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Surely the red bird has to be Iago. Though it’s a bit odd that he’s the pet of the Oracle.
Oh, I think the Oracle is Jafar. The way the eyes glowed red…total Snake move.
Matt just brought this up: remember what he did to Amara in WL? He turned her into the snake! So maybe the Oracle is really the bird staff and I’m pretty sure Jafar is impersonating the Oracle.
That makes a lot of sense, and would provide and nice, neat way for them to connect the Aladdin and Emma stories up at some point.
[adrotate group="5"]And then I liked that Belle wasn’t buying it, because of so many broken promises, and she’s not just gonna go back to him. That’s exactly the reaction she should be having right now after what they’ve been through, and they gave her the agency to say “NO”.
Yeah. I think that’s the point of her dream, too. It’s not meant to be an accurate retelling of events and feelings back then. It’s how she feels about the relationship now, with several years of mature hindsight.
Indeed, the subconscious is a clever thing, and it will happily slap you in the face with the truth of a matter when your guard is down while you’re alseep.
It’s been a long time since I disagreed with Phee (like five years)
Do we ever disagree on any show ever? LOL For the record, I don’t think we actually super disagree on most of this stuff, I think it’s just that my bar was set SO low that in this instance I’m kinda gobsmacked by actually liking stuff in the show again, and so am being a bit more forgiving of some details than I would typically be.
How exactly did Snow know that Regina was at the vault? And later how did Snow know that Regina was sitting on that bench and needed to talk?
At the vault I have no idea, that was just random. We only saw Regina tell Zelena that she was going to the vault, and I doubt that Zelena and Snow are txting buddies for her to have passed on that info. At the bench however, that was right outside City Hall, and I can imagine that after the vault conversation, Snow might have gone looking for Regina later to see if she’d spoken to Zelena yet, and Town Hall is a reasonable place to go looking if you’re trying to find Regina.
Snow has no character motivation of her own except through Regina’s story which is frustrating.
Snow has sadly been a whole lotta NOTHING for some time now. I think she’s a fitting person to have Regina speak to though, because of their long and sordid history. If anyone in town has the capacity to have honest emo loaded conversations with Regina, it’s a short list and Snow’s at the top of it. Of course I’d love for Snow to be an actual, interesting character again, but Ginny being given actual meaningful dialogue and screentime in this ep, I’m taking it as a baby step towards getting her properly involved again.
This argument between Zelena and Regina super bothered me. It doesn’t make any sense with what came before this season.
What super bothered me was them being turned into insta-sisters in the Underworld. That just did not sit right with me, so I’m good with it if it turns out they’re actually not all happy families with each other. This dynamic where they have issues with each other and aren’t getting along feels more truthful to me, so even if it’s a bit retcon-y, I’m actually glad that they’re backtracking.
They literally get back from NYC/LUtS and there’s a crisis within 20 seconds but somehow Zelena knows to move into the mansion? And has her bags and stuff mostly unpacked? How? When did this conversation even happen?
Agreed that it was random to suddenly have her moving in. But I can fanwank that they had a conversation immediately following Robin’s funeral, where Regina made the offer for Zelena and baby Robyn to move in with her.
You’re right, it’s about freaking time but this is what annoys me. Where was Jimminy when Neal died? When Hook died? When Emma came up with the hairbrained solution to go to the Underworld and rescue Hook?
Jimminy/Raphael should have never been demoted. There are so many times he should have been involved! Though I guess if they had a character who was an always present member of the main cast whose job is to talk sense into people, then we’d have no show. 😛 I haven’t forgiven them for forgetting he existed for so long, but regardless I’m still glad they eventually remembered that he exists, and they’re using him to call out Emma being a hot mess.
Archie’s mere presence makes me think that maybe they’re not just blowing smoke when they talk about wanting to get back to the S1 feel and their core characters. This show has fallen FAR from grace, and if they do actually plan to get it even remotely back on track, it’s gonna take baby steps, lots of them. The character moments in this ep felt like potential baby steps to me. Like things that they’ve finally acknowledged to themselves that they’ve stuffed up, so they’re gonna try to turn some aspects of the show around. Whether it lasts, or I’m totally wrong and the rest of the season is just more of the same old, (which wouldn’t really surprise me), remains to be seen.
“Our son, he was testing me, playing the part of Morpheus to see if I’d do right by him.” So he wasn’t actual Morpheus. But still, I can’t believe that RG’s crackpot theory about Morpheus being the RumBelle baby actually came true. *facepalm*
For what it’s worth, which may be nothing, because what’s really real in a dream world, but he had purple smoke, not dark purple, more of a mauve.
Surely the red bird has to be Iago. Though it’s a bit odd that he’s the pet of the Oracle.
I fear that this whole business with Aladdin’s Saviour story will end up feeling convoluted and shoehorned in. And whatever they do with Jafar just won’t jive with his story from WL, and the whole thing will annoy me on principle.
My favourite thing was seeing Snow calling out that her name was Snow White, and Charming calling her Snow, and just…Mary Margaret is so dead and it makes me so happy.
Perhaps it’s because I went in with sub-zero expectations, but I actually thought this was one of the best episodes in quite some time. Because characters actually had conversations with each other. All the talk from the showrunners about wanting to focus more on their core characters and I was over here like, “I’ll believe that if and when I see it,” so colour me somewhat shocked that there were actual character moments in this ep.
The whole bit with Zelena looking for the feather from Roland, that had nothing to do with plot, but they actually kept it in the episode. It was a moment of development for the relationship between Regina and Zelena that she actually seemed to genuinely want to find it for her. And it also served to show how Regina’s still in the grieving process. They actually acknowledged that Robin is gone and Regina is not OK.
Regina venting to Snow about how it made her mad that Zelena lost the feather. Snow telling her to talk to Zelena about whatever the real issue is. And then they actually did end up having that conversation! Regina aired her resentment towards Zelena for her part in Robin’s death, and (this may well be my own resentment towards Zelena over Neal’s death talking but) I loved that Regina let that out and told Zelena right to her face. And then Zelena airing her own resentment over Regina ripping out the part of her that was most like her. Guys, I pretty much hate Zelena, she’s been pretty much dead to me and I’ve wanted her off my screen ever since that moment at the vault with Neal and Belle, but in this moment with Regina, I actually felt kinda sorry for Zelena, and I never thought the day would come where I’d say that.
They actually had the sisters voice their feelings and hash them out and every interaction they had in this ep felt like a geuine aspect of their relationship to me. They dedicated a significant chunk of airtime to their relationship in this ep, and granted they were working towards the result of them splitting so Zelena could shack up with EQ and move some plot along, but they could have just not had Zelena moving in with Regina to begin with, and jumped right to her with EQ, and not spent any time on the sisters development. But they actually spent airtime to show us characters discussing their feelings. They didn’t just slap them into a situation where they were buddies like nothing ever happened. And they didn’t just slap them in a situation where they were adversaries. They actually gave their relationship a little arc in this ep that made sense, to get them to where they wanted them to be.
Archie! It’s one of the things about spoilers that had made me legit happy, knowing that Archie was gonna be back, and I thought they used him well. Sure we’ve been through, “Emma has walls and blah, blah, blah,” before, but I appreciated that her parents had actually been to the town shrink to ask him to check on her, and here he was giving her advice, just like Jimminy Cricket should. It’s about freaking time!
For the first time in a long time, it felt to me like Rumple actually did genuinely care for Belle, and was willing to make her wellbeing his #1 priority. He was even willing to just tell her about Bae, and why he left, and how it was his own fault for having been afraid. And sure I’ll only really believe that Rumple can change if and when he actually does and it sticks, but I actually felt like this time he actually meant it more than ever before. And then I liked that Belle wasn’t buying it, because of so many broken promises, and she’s not just gonna go back to him. That’s exactly the reaction she should be having right now after what they’ve been through, and they gave her the agency to say “NO”. I really felt both of their persepctives were geniune, and it was important for them to both say the things they did to each other.
And then the scene between Snow and Regina. It was 3 solid minutes (including the montage scenes when Regina was still speaking) of two people just sitting on a bench having a quiet conversation about who they were, and who they are, and how far they’ve come. Since when does that happen on this show?!
Now don’t get me wrong, I could write a long list of nitpicks and things I wanna grumble about as well, (and I’m sure I’ll get into that stuff in other posts). But for the first time in ages, I finished an ep of OUAT and felt like I’d just watched actual characters on emotional journeys, instead of just ridiculous plot and people acting in unbelivable ways to service said plot. I actually went back to re-watch some scenes, and that’s something I haven’t done since probably the midway point of S3. And I actually typed a novel length post for the forum, which I haven’t been inspired to do in ages.
I’m not back on the OUAT love train, I’m not instilled with a new sense of #hope (*twitch*), but just looking at this ep in and of itself, let’s just say that I was pleasantly surprised on more than one occasion.
AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
More coherent thoughts to come after I’ve had time to process what I just watched
Is there a reason we haven’t gotten a blue fairy flashback yet? It’s things like that which make me think she’s more important to the end game of this show.
My dream series finale – They have Blue just lose her crap and freak out because “I’ve been sitting back, trying to not help you as much as possible, waiting for you all to destroy yourselves for so long now, and so many times you came SO CLOSE and my ultimate goal was NEARLY realised. But I can see now that you morons are just too incompetent and if you want something done right you’ve just gotta do it yourself!” Then she’ll enact some spell that’s a cataclysmic Storybrooke ending event, and the last thing we ever see is a smug looking Blue wandering through the desolation and then out into the real world to wreak some havoc.
It’s times like these I really wish we could use really bad words on this forum, because you kinda need them in order to convey the extent of the stupidity that is this article!!
Obvioulsy a big WORD to what you all have said about the Trolls and how pooply they handled this, (I just noticed this typo, it was meant to be “poorly” but actually I’m editing the post to say that I’m gonna leave that typo, because it totally works). But I’d also like to give an honourary mention to the person who wrote this article in the first place, with that headline, just trying to bait the crap out of the poor Hoodies. NOTHING ABOUT THIS ARTICLE IS COOL OR OK.
“And by moving on, we don’t mean like falling in love with someone right away. That’s not realistic to us,” Horowitz explained. “This was someone she did love and who she did lose, and we hope that we deal with that grief and his aftermath in a real way.”
That sound you heard was Neal Cassidy violently rolling over and over and over in his deader than dead grave.
If they play it right it could potentially add an interesting dynamic to Ivy and Cat’s relationship. Especially in this episode they drummed into us how much younger Ivy was, how much more naive, and how Cat was the older, wiser one. That won’t be the case the next time they run into each other. Just…PLZ do something more meaningful with it, rather than just having her suddenly old enough to play the sex kitten.
Jamie! Mulan, AKA: Valerie! I shall continue to think she’s Mulan and that she finally escaped the ONCEiverse and changed her name to Valerie.
I like Valerie alot, the lady’s got spunk! She impressed right off the bat when she’s bombarding the Mayor and Barnes with questions, not being willing to buy into their half answers. And the way her eyes lit up when Penguin came in spilling truth tea all over the place was great.
“I get drunk when I want…I sleep. Cause saving Gotham isn’t my job anymore..” This is an interesting new take on Jim. He’s been “dark” before but not “morose” and here’s he’s almost without hope; a vigilante before Gotham’s Baby!Batman can grow up. In order to be the hero Gotham needs, can you do it alone? Subtle foreshadowing for Batman too.
I’m all about the foreshadowing. Seeing a Jim Gordon who has been through this phase in his life adds a dimension to his future relationship with Batman. I think maybe Valerie’s enthusiasm to do her job in a way that she believes will help the city, will rub off on Jim and bring him out of the hopeless, bounty hunting funk he’s in at the moment and eventually inspire him to go back to being a cop.
Also, we can’t mention that quote from Jim about drinking without also mentioning, “And do you really think I don’t get drunk when I want? *slurp*” from Harvey.
Also, we can’t mention that scene without me mentioning that I love Lucius.
LOL at Penguin bringing Nygma a puzzle box, a sweater, and biscuits. Like some sort of bizarre married couple.
The Nygmobblepot shippers must have been in HEAVEN over that scene! I liked Ed making the little origami penguin and telling Oswald that “Penguins. Eat. Fish.”
Leah moved on that quickly? It was only a few weeks in between leaving Gotham and when Jim went to find her, right?
She left Gotham while he was in jail, didn’t she? And he was in jail for some time because there was that montage of him outside in the yard at the jail through different types of weather to indicate the passing of seasons. I don’t recall if it was specified at what point during his stay in jail that she left town?
What on earth is Fish wearing?? What is that cape??
Are you really surprised that Fish got herself a cape tho? When she was walking and it was all billowing out, it kinda looked a bit like a manta ray gliding along, so maybe that’s what they were going for with the fishy aesthetic? I did really like the collar part on it.
Still really confused by Clone!Baby!Batman
Can we take a minute to give props to David, because for such a young actor he’s going a great job of playing these two characters so distinctly.
Speaking of child actors, while the ageing up of Ivy is still in the “RLY now is that necessary” basket, at least they did find a nice way of working the “how” of it into the story, by having that guy who ages people grab her for just a second before she fell.
