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I mostly just wanted to reply because I find it entertaining that our astrology signs shape the way we approach the show, and our enjoyment of it. ^_^
I’m pretty much a textbook definition of Pisces. My friend who’s into astrology and did my birth chart was laughing as she was calculating it all and said she’d never known anyone to be SUCH a Pisces. I pride myself on it, but also regularly drive myself insane. š
[adrotate group="5"]It’s mind bendy awesome. Obviously they couldn’t copy the concept exactly because copyright, but they could still take the concept and make it their own.
Like, if this is essentially what Zelena plans to do to Regina, burn her “thread” back completely to erase her existence, then maybe she succeeds, (hence the BTS pics from the finale) and then they manage to turn the same process around and use it on Zelena, and burn her thread back to at least before she left Oz to shack up in Regina’s castle, which was the point in her history when she became a threat to them, so they need to undo everything back to that point in order to defeat her.
I guess that could essentially leave them all back where they were at the start of 312, but still potentially with the memories of everything that happened from 312 on if they keep that aspect of the baelfire concept. So Regina would know that her psycho sister is gonna hijack her protection spell, so she’s gotta get to the castle first to set a trap for her. And Neal and Belle know about the Vault, but they also know the consequences of using the Key, so it goes back to Belle’s comments that they’ll find another way to bring Rumple back. And Emma and Henry are back in NYC, but they now know that their family and everyone is back in FTL, and they know that Walsh is the MonkeyWizard, and Emma can ask him to help them reunite with everyone, kill Zelena, and break his Monkey curse.
(Stream of consciousness crackpot theorising at 3am FTW. š )
Interesting theories everyone but I refuse to get my hopes up about anything with this show.
And I COMPLETELY understand that sentiment. My problem is I’m a pathological daydreamer (it’s a Pisces thing, I can’t help it) and the more my mind wanders on this topic, the more opportunity I see for them to be able to bring him back, and the more opportunities I see, the more I just wanna declare SHENANIGANS on the whole hot mess.
All events that could have been said to have “happened” before the destruction of an individual’s thread are remembered by any other individual, though the physical reality of the situation is now changed; anyone that was witness or party to the “reversal” of time will still remember all the events that were undone as if they had actually happened even if the effects themselves no longer exist.
Balefire can even bring people back from the dead, or rather, prevent them from dying in the first place; Aviendha, Asmodean and Matrim Cauthon were brought back to life when Rahvin was hit by balefire with enough force to undo the attack that caused their deaths. In another instance, Mat was saved when the Darkhounds that attacked him were burned away to the point before injuring him.
The Dark One is unable to resurrect any person who is killed by balefire, mentioning himself that he is not capable of “stepping outside of Time.” As balefire technically causes a person to die in the past, it is assumed that the Dark One can only resurrect someone within a certain time-span, with balefire exceeding that limit. Another possibility is that due to the nature of the wheel, when a person dies, their thread does not end, but is simply set aside until it is used again/reincarnated as another person. Balefire burns the thread meaning that the thread can no longer be used in the Pattern’s weave.
Baelfire on the Wheel Of time wiki.
VERY interesting find, thanks for the info. Was reading some of the forum posts in that link and some gave me headaches…
You see, the person when balefiring himself ceases to exist before he even decides to balefire himself.
Therefore, he simply ceases to exist at some random time. If he had not ceased to exist, he would have decided to balefire himself. But he can’t decide to balefire himself unless he ceases to exist before it happens.
Some made more sense…
Take a string and hold a small flame up to one end of it. A piece of it gets burned off right? Well that’s balefire. It’s like putting a flame to the thread of a person’s life.
Now get a bigger flame and put it to one end of the string. More gets burned off, right? That’s the way it works. The stronger the weave for balefire, the farther back the person will be burned out of the pattern. It would take a very very very strong weave to burn someone entirely out of the pattern.
Then I got to posts where people started talking about the Dark One, so I googled to see and yes the Wheel Of Time has a Dark One as well as a thing called Baelfire, and that’s about the point where I decided this can’t be coincidence.
I didnāt watch āLostā but I read there was an actual wheel in that show, which was a driving force in the plot.
While Neal getting his second chance would be a good way to redeem the message of the story, I still feel like it would be extremely contrived. The mark of a good story is not to be sensationalistic for the sake of shock-value. To me, the mark of a truly excellent story would be to have Nealās ending be truly meaningful. The more natural completion of Nealās story arc would have been to die in 2Ć21, having given up his life so that Henry wouldāve have to grow up like he and Emma did. That to me would have been a just end. This ending where Neal made the same mistake as his father, by rashly saying to **** with consequences, is to vilify an otherwise noble character. Nealās demise was self-inflicted, though of course manipulated by Zelena, and seemed uncharacteristic since Neal was Baelfire and knew better than anyone the steep price of dark magic. Neal grew up alone, without a father, all because of Rumpleās mistakes. The sins of the father fell upon the son, which is unfair. That is the message that 3Ć15 send, life is cruel, and then you die. That is my rather longwinded way of saying that even if the writers reverse history and bring back Baelfire, it still comes across as shoddy writing.
Oh I totally agree, IF they did bring Neal back, and if SF ended up getting their happily ever after (because let’s face it, IF Neal comes back, SF will be inevitable and invincible, if it proves that Adam wasn’t talking out of his arse the other day when he tweeted that Neal did deserve a happy ending, they emphasised in 315 that that happy ending = Tallahassee, and Tallahassee is something that neither one of them could truly find with anyone else, because it was THEIR dream), then I still never intend to re-watch the scene where he used the key, or the scene where he died, because it was a pile of OOC crap that I wouldn’t endorse even if they undid it. I’m just saying that as the story stands right now, with what we’ve been given, I can see how it could play out to a story arc conclusion that does eventually make sense thematically if they bring him back. I’d much rather have NOT taken this contrived path of character assassination in order to get there, even if they did ultimately end up together.
The thing that’s stuck in my brain about the second chances thing is that it was stated blatantly in this ep. The phrase from Neal’s promo poster was stated blatantly as a theme for the central storyline in S3B. They knew when they made those promo posters what the themes of each half season would be, (A&E likely pitched S3A as being about belief and S3B being about second chances). We all said his hand was in his pocket because of the swan pendant, and whaddya know, in S3B he pulled the swan pendant out of his pocket. And now his slogan is being used as one of the show’s big themes. I’m not necessarily sayin’, but I’m just sayin’, maybe Zelena will achieve her second chance at life, and a by product of whatever she does will be Neal getting a second chance at life too. I mean, it’d actually fit quite nicely, thematically speaking. (If they don’t bring him back then obviously the poster is just a sick joke, but I’m just sayin’.)
But Cora gave up Zelena because she was going to prevent Cora from becoming royal.
They didn’t exactly word it as though Zelena was preventing it IMO. “You couldn’t give her the one thing she truly wanted, the ability to become royalty.” That could translate to Cora having gotten pregnant by a royal, expecting to end up as part of the family, but the baby daddy wasn’t interested in marrying her in the end.
I also sort of laugh-weeped at Henry pointing out that Hook teaching Bae about navigation makes no sense since like, arenāt you the same age as him? Even the characters are pointing out how little sense the plot makes!
Indeed! I did appreciate that Henry was sharp enough to pick up instantly how wrong that sounded. I did appreciate that Hook looked like he felt genuinely sorry for how confused Henry must be. And I appreciated that he told Emma that Henry should know who his father was. Basically, I appreciate Hook displaying real emotions about Neal and/or Henry, as opposed to just constantly moping about his emotions for Emma.
Now if only he’d come clean about his history with Bae. He thinks Henry deserves to know the truth about his father, but he still doesn’t want everyone to know the full truth about himself and Henry’s father.
