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@Cherish wrote:
Just have her be responsible for her own actions and grow from them. Don’t excuse them and try to rationalize them. Evil isn’t rational, so trying to make sense of Regina’s most evil deeds is kind of useless. I don’t expect the writers to justify or excuse Rumpel killing his wife or killing his maid. So, why do it with Regina?
Regina’s more human than Rumple. That’s the reason I find her actions harder to excuse than Rumple’s. This ep was the first time when I legit felt heartache for Regina. Doesn’t mean I automatically excuse what she’s done though, because the whole way along, she’s made bad choices that she needs to be held accountable for. But I did feel her pain when Daniel was attacking her and she had to kill him. That moment was a nice little contrast to the scene where she killed her father. Back then, he was begging for his life, and here, Daniel was begging for his death.
Anyway, it sucks for Regina that they set her up to become Rumple’s monster. She was manipulated by the master. Jefferson was manipulated by Rumple too. They were both pawns in his game, Jefferson seduced by his paycheque and Regina by her lust for power and inability to let Daniel go.
But if this was indeed the incident that caused Regina to later punish Jefferson, that means she’s wrongly punished someone for the second time. First it was Snow, who was clearly manipulated by Cora, but Regina still blamed Snow. Then it was Jefferson who was clearly manipulated by Rumple, but Regina still blamed Jefferson.
Jefferson is someone who wasn’t exactly squeaky clean, but there came a point in his life where he had a reality check and realised what was truly important and changed his focus, even if it meant collecting fungus and living on the poverty line. Regina’s moment like that should have been, (if it hadn’t come beforehand), when she was standing there thinking about killing her father. But she still made the wrong choice and killed him. I can’t easily excuse that.
[adrotate group="5"]This incident would certainly have given her cause to abandon Jefferson in another land, separating him from the one he loves. It’d also explain why she cursed him to remember the love he’d lost.
I’d think she’d hate Rumple more if she knew the whole story though. Granted, they’re not BFFs, but she’s still happy to work with him, which I doubt she would be if she knew the whole truth. Unless she did know, but kept that fact hidden, so she could play him, (or so she thought), pretend to still be good natured frenemies, just enough to get him to give her the curse, and in casting it, she not only got revenge on Snow, but also on Rumple.
I just posted this over in the Ruby Slippers thread, but it fits here, so *copy paste*….
I sorta hope that the Wizard of Oz is only the Wizard of Oz, and not also Frankenstein, but now that I think about it, it could work. We didn’t see Jefferson go to get Victor in this ep. We saw Jefferson happen to run into Regina at just the right time to offer to hook her up with Victor, but later, it turned out that the whole thing was a setup by Rumple to turn Regina into a monster. Maybe Rumple had sent Jefferson to Oz with a shopping list: crystal ball, magical slippers, Wizard. And he brought back 2 out of the 3, though in that initial scene, he was only seen to hand over 1, because it was all part of the ruse to corrupt Regina.
@Josephine wrote:
The Wicked Witch of the West had a crystal ball. It could be hers and the slippers are her sister’s that Dorothy took. The reference that Jefferson made about hearing they’ve moved to another land and Rumple saying he needed them to get to that land is totally referring to Dorothy. She took the slippers back with her to Kansas (even if she didn’t in the real story), which is in a land without magic, and Rumple needs to get to that land.
YES! Dear God but I do love how K&H can weave stories together like this! Who knew that the Mad Hatter was in Oz just after Dorothy had left and that Rumplestiltskin wanted the famous slippers. So fun! 😀
I sorta hope that the Wizard of Oz is only the Wizard of Oz, and not also Frankenstein, but now that I think about it, it could work. We didn’t see Jefferson go to get Victor in this ep. We saw Jefferson happen to run into Regina at just the right time to offer to hook her up with Victor, but later, it turned out that the whole thing was a setup by Rumple to turn Regina into a monster. Maybe Rumple had sent Jefferson to Oz with a shopping list: crystal ball, magical slippers, Wizard. And he brought back 2 out of the 3, though in that initial scene, he was only seen to hand over 1, because it was all part of the ruse to corrupt Regina.
You’d think that his brother would have to be someone significant, otherwise they wouldn’t have written the monster as being his brother, he would have just been a random monster. But they made him family, which means they intend to explore that story more.
@cruel_fortuna wrote:
I think the story of Victor & his brother will probably be the lead in for season 3 because I’d wager by the end of this season, they’ll have or rather, need the ability to travel to other worlds. Theirs will just so happen to be ideal.
And won’t Victor just love that, if the magical folks are in trouble and need his science, then he can throw Rumple’s words back in his face.
@Rockin314 wrote:
I think his brother may be Dracula. Seems a stretch but it makes sense that his land is the land of “science fiction”, so clearly we will start seeing new creatures in the show. Also, Victor said that he messed up on his brother the first time. He brought him to life, but maybe not “living”. The undead. Now he wants to get back to help his brother have a full life.
I’m officially intrigued by this theory. Victor did live in a castle in the mountains, and so did Dracula, so assuming they lived together, we may have just seen Dracula’s castle. Hmmm.
@Hannah97 wrote:
@Elle wrote:
I had thought that he became the monster, but I am not sure if perhaps Daniel was the monster. But then seeing the arm of his brother, and how stitched up it was, does imply that he was the monster. 🙂
Or there’s more than one monster.
His brother has to be THE monster, otherwise we wouldn’t have the story of Dr Frankenstein and his monster in our world. The stuff with Daniel was playing out in our present day, so he was A monster of Frankenstein’s, but not THE monster.
I reckon SwanFire is probably endgame, so they’re not gonna hook those two up in the foreseeable future. Emma will have an attraction to and/or a fling with one or two others before SwanFire happens, and I can totally see one of those flirtations being with Hook.
Looks like Mulan is gonna get TOLD by Snow. You don’t mess with Snow, especially when Emma’s involved.
Can’t wait to see Jorge as the Giant!
Love Hook’s, “You never forget your first beanstalk,” line. I’m guessing his arrival in Neverland will be something memorable.
@Naomi wrote:
Well, the CTV promos are always really sneaky. My gut feeling is that the “baby bump” shot and the “what I really want is you” shot are not filmed together. I think they’re taken from different parts of the episode.
I’m on team cynic as well. Totally not trusting that part of the promo. 😉
@Lil’Red wrote:
One idea that I can get out: how did Emma manage to keep the yellow bug for ten years after stealing it and going to jail? My guess: it was the Mysterious Man’s (Baelfire’s?). We know he has a thing for collecting older items and in the stills for this episode – looks like he’s in the back seat when Emma’s pulled over and then moves to the front. I guess I’m suggesting that Henry’s dad was sleeping in the back seat (probably living in his car) when Emma decides to steal it and that’s how they meet…
LOVE this idea of how they could meet! It’d be perfect.
As for how she kept the bug even after going to jail, I just had a thought…do we even know for sure that it’s the same bug? Maybe she bought one that looked just like the original one, for sentimental reasons. Anyway, whether or not it’s exactly the same bug, it’ll stop Neal dead in his tracks when he gets to SB and sees it.
@AntBee wrote:
Yes, I guess it’s just one of those theories that neither side will yield to until we know for sure. It also seems to be one of those theories that people either really love or really hate.
Hated it the first time I saw it suggested, but then decided they could do some interesting stuff with it, so now am thinking it’s a definite possibility.
Crazy idea, but maybe Pongo alerts Henry to the imposters? LOL. Maybe he barks like crazy around fake!Snow and fake!Emma, and that’s how they figure out. Just a thought. Not to be taken seriously, guys.
Great idea. That’s usually part of the impostor trope too in that the person’s pet or a friend of the person’s pet, usually a dog, always reacts negatively to the impostor because the pets know it’s not really the true person and the pet always gets blamed for his/her behavior.
Good point about the animals often being the first to sense that something is wrong. I kinda love that they’re gonna give Pongo another cameo appearance.
I know a lot of people have questioned why Ruby wouldn’t know then, and really I don’t have an answer to that especially if Pongo can sense it. Although I’m sure the writers can think of a way to work around it like maybe Ruby’s still rattled by whatever happens in episode 7 and being accused of murder that she’s not really paying attention to the outside world that much since she’s worried that she might have done it and/or being found guilty.
She could potentially take measures to try and suppress that part of herself after whatever happens in ep 7. I’m thinking of something more drastic than just wearing her cape. If magic doesn’t work the same in SB, her cape may not work, if they even have it there. So she may try some other method to rid her of her wolfness.
Can we take a moment to appreciate Snow’s upturned collar.
Nice find. I still think it’s Cora as Snow in disguise with her collar because it’s just a totally different vibe that Ginnifer Goodwin is giving off then her Snow vibe, the same with Jennifer Morrison as Emma in those pictures.
Yes, Ginny’s stance seems more…proper, I guess is the word. I know it’s just one still picture, so it may not really be proper evidence of how she’s carrying herself in the scene, but that’s all we have to judge right now. It’s also the fact that it’s BOTH of them that seem to resemble their potential alter egos. If just one of them looked slightly different, I’d think nothing of it, but it’s both of them, so I’m suspicious.
Also, they’ve gone to the trouble of showing us that Cora can shapeshift. Sure, it served the storyline of her impersonating Lancelot, but they could have written her into that storyline in other ways. They could have just had her popping in and out and secretly spying and following Snow and Emma to the castle. But they chose the shapeshifting route, and I can’t help but wonder if they did that to establish that power of hers as foreshadowing to shapeshifting in SB too.
I think that’s why we’re getting a Hook-centric and Cora-centric episode right before the mid-season break with them heading towards Storybrooke before Emma and Snow or possibly at the same time as Emma and Snow, depending on what exactly Grumpy finds in Storybrooke that could help the latter come back. I think they want to set up how villainous Hook and Cora really right before they come to Storybrooke that way there’s more tension because we really haven’t seen any of their evil deeds especially Hook’s. Plus, I love everyone worrying over winter about whether or not Hook and Cora will arrive in Storybrooke before Emma and Snow, and just when everyone feels relief because it looks like Emma and Snow beat Hook and Cora to Storybrooke, they do the part of the impostor trope by revealing it’s not really Emma and Snow but Hook and Cora as them because they turn back to their true selves, which is why Colin O’Donoghue and Barbara Hershey were on set at the same time, well that and to fool onlookers who might leak out information.
Agreed, I think that given the timing of the centric eps, and the way they’ll build the tension, the impostor storyline could fit quite nicely as the climax to that. Ep10 will almost definitely be after the mid season break, won’t it? They wouldn’t be able to have the shock reveal in ep10 as a cliffhanger right before the break?
Cool idea. I’d never really expected to see him again, but that may well be where they came up with the idea for his name.
