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@Slurpeez108 Interesting theory, I like it – it makes sense. Philora aren’t the type to go dark but they ARE worried about their baby’s safety. They seem to be ‘in’ with the WWW so they might have a good idea about what she is planning to do – good candidates for double agents. And Aurora does have that history with working with Hook before, he saved her heart, and she does know that he cares for Emma (even though her heart was being controlled at the time). It would be the perfect way to keep a “is it a trick or not” question hanging over the show for awhile. Are they working with the WWW to protect their baby or are they working against the WWW to protect their baby?
[adrotate group="5"]I looked at it again because I wondered the same thing the first time I watched it but the handwriting looks different to me. Then I remembered that Hook has been to Neal’s apartment before so he would know exactly where it is so he could have written the address down himself – and the handwriting on the address note looks kind of old world flowy which would match up with Hook’s age compared to the writing on the letter which looks more modern. Yes, sadly this is how closely I looked at it.
I am honestly all kinds of confused about the interviews and episodes now. I think they must have had about 4 hours worth of footage, did all the interviews, and then threw the final one hour version of 312 together at 6:45 last night. Because it seems like no one, including A and E or the cast has any idea exactly what was supposed to happen in 312. Which now leads me to wonder if any if the articles that mention what is going to happen in other specific episodes are going to be accurate.
Okay, just did my re-watch. Woo-hoo!! Even better the second time (it always is – I catch so much more). Where to start??
So Henry makes the comment that he can tell that Emma really likes Walsh because he’s the first guy she’s dated that he’s ever met. So were there memories implanted that she had dated other guys? Did she actually date other guys before Walsh? She acknowledges that he is perceptive so obviously she isn’t going to have some random guy she is casually dating meeting Henry. I thought it was interesting then how they made a point of having Emma have Hook stay with Henry in the middle of Storybrooke while she went to go see her parents – she has no problem leaving Henry alone with Hook even though as far as Henry is concerned he just met this guy a hot second ago. I’m guessing that we are going to have Henry being very perceptive about his mom’s feelings throughout the rest of the season. He told her to go with what her instincts were telling her to do about how she felt about marrying Walsh and he told her that he just wants her to be happy when talking about her decision about Walsh. I think that a lot of the discussion around SF has been that Emma needs to choose Neal because it is what Henry needs to have his family together,etc. Having Henry tell Emma that he just wants her to be happy and that she should go with her instinct is setting it up for Henry to help her decide that it is okay for her to want someone who ISN’T his biological father if that is what makes her happy. Plus his very RATIONAL conversation about what happened with Neal and how it AFFECTED his mother in her personal relationships. It wasn’t a Neal bashing conversation and even when he does find out the “truth” about why his dad wasn’t around he is STILL going to have the understanding of how what he did to her affected his mother in a negative way.
Henry replied to Emma that he got so smart when he got to level 16 and became a knight. I believe that at the end of baby Emma’s crib in her EF nursery were two dolls – one was a pirate/sailor and the other was a knight. Could that be foreshadowing?? Does Henry become a knight when he turns 16? Do the two dolls at the end of her crib represent her two True Loves?? Her son and (hopefully at some point) her husband, Killian. Just a thought.
Both Hook and Neal talked about how Regina said that all their belongings would make it to the EF with them. I don’t remember that part from 3A but okay. Since Hook was the one who brought it up it made me wonder if he wasn’t really ONLY going after the JR. I wonder if he is going after something that he believes will get him back to Emma. Neal asks about it as well so I believe he is thinking the same thing about both Rumple and Emma. However, I think Snow plants in his mind that there isn’t any way to get back to Emma without another curse being enacted. This happens at the same time Charming tells him that he knows that Neal is hurting and that he misses Emma just as much as they do but even if they could get back to her she wouldn’t remember them. Here’s where I have a wacked theory. I don’t think Neal sees a curse or Emma’s inability to remember him as a bad thing and this is where I see his potential to go dark. Neal has had to deal with the fact that he can’t get Emma back because she can’t move past her memories of what he did to her (or didn’t do in the case of not coming to get her after the curse was broken) in combination with her feelings for Killian. If he can enact a curse that can play with her memory so she remembers the good stuff about him but forgets the bad and remembers only the bad of Hook then he could think he could “win” her. This would be consistent with going on a quest with Belle who has been able to love his father in spite of all the horrible things he has done and who has continually believed that there is good inside of him no matter how horrible he has behaved. I think Belle would be the perfect person to never see it coming since she always sees the good in people. She would be so wrapped up in her own quest for Rumple that she wouldn’t even recognize what Neal was up to.
It annoyed me that Charming didn’t understand that Hook was in pain – he should have seen what was going on. It didn’t make any sense that he couldn’t see through Hook needing to escape because of how much he misses Emma.
Was shocked by what they did with the dream catcher – “Flypaper for nightmares, Neal.” Wow! Neal is flypaper for nightmares. I wasn’t expecting that at all, she actually seemed appalled to see the thing. No warm and fuzzy SF feels going on AT ALL in that apartment.
Loved that they paralleled having Emma chain Hook up like they did in Tallahassee with him yelling “Swan.”
But my biggest theory. Emma knew EXACTLY who Hook was the whole time. I mean she didn’t know he was Hook but she knew she knew him. So we have Walsh proposing to her after 8 months of dating, in which she has already been comfortable enough to tell him that she loves him and consider marrying him even though she says she doesn’t do “fast.” Yet it takes like 3 sketchy meetings from a weird guy dressed like a pirate who seems to be in cahoots with the guy who set her up and left her pregnant in jail and (according to her) could have photoshopped pictures of her and Henry on a camera to drink what could be poison??? NO FREAKING WAY. There is no way Emma Swan does that, even version 2.0 Emma Swan. So consider when she tells Walsh that she can’t marry him. She tells him that she has to go HOME, she says someone from her past has come back, someone who is “like a GHOST.” What do ghosts do?? THEY HAUNT YOU!!!! She has been haunted by memories of Hook for the entire year!!! Probably in her dreams, probably when something happened and she got a weird sense of déjà vu. She’s been dating Walsh for 8 months, loves him but can’t decide to marry him? She’s seem crazy pirate boy for like two days and trusts him enough to drink weird bottle of who knows what it could be because he tells her to take a leap of faith? No way. They were BOTH thinking of each other every day while they were apart from each other. I think Emma was probably having difficulty trying to figure out what was going on and then suddenly when Hook showed up things started to make sense.
My heart BREAKS for Hook though. I think he has a long road back to Emma between believing she doesn’t love him and her once again throwing her walls up. My heart literally hurts when I watch him during the scene in Emma’s apartment. I honestly didn’t like Emma very much there but had to remind myself that she was taken out of what she was trying to convince herself was a perfect life because she is once again telling herself the Savior never gets a day off.
But then the scene with Henry and Hook was great. It was adorable how excited Hook was to see Henry again and how he looked him up and down like “Wow! You grew! (Just like we all did!). And then the “Why are YOU dressed like THAT?” line. The other thing I caught was that Emma had just told Henry that their trip would be “like an adventure” and then she opened the door and the old, confident Hook was back and said “Ready, Swan?” and strolled right in like he used to, because he is at his BEST when he is on an adventure with Emma.
And of course, my heart skipped a beat each time Emma called him Killian. Sigh.
I just realized something. The look on his face and the look on her face as they look at each other right as she gets her memories back are exactly the same as before they said “goodbye” to each other in the end of 3A except they don’t have tears in their eyes. It’s like they are picking up exactly where they left off before the new curse took over. So I can see where Colin and JMo would have thought it felt right to hug – because when they were saying goodbye they both wanted to hug but . . . couldn’t, now they could. But at the same time I could see the reason for NOT going with the hug. As much as he loves Emma, Hook thinks TLK didn’t work. He wants to believe that Emma loved him and might love him again but as soon as her memories come back, his walls start to slam back up in protection mode and Captain Innuendo is the only way he knows how to deal with that with Emma so being cocky and asking “Did you miss me?” was a safer option for him because he KNOWS the answer to that question is “no” because she didn’t remember him. “Do you love me?” is a trickier one and after the “Good” he must have played over and over in his mind for a year, a much more painful for one for him to debate the answer to. Sobs.
I have my own theory about the missing hugs but I’m not exactly thrilled about it so not all that sure I want to say it but here it goes.
I know that Adam has increasingly become frustrated over the past several months with people sending nasty tweets to him and the cast, shipping wars, fans sending hate mail threatening to stop watching the show if their ship doesn’t end up together, spoiler pics leaking on-line, etc. I think the Rumple/Pan pics leaking really ticked them off because it pretty much gave away their whole enormous 3A reveal. I think they pride themselves on the twists and turns this show takes and being able to shock and surprise the audience. And while they LOVE the super uber loyal extreme fans like use, I really think they are getting tired of having to keep up so hard with all the rumors, spoilers, hate, and damage control.
Remember when some irate fan tweeted Adam about the CS hug way back when and he replied “That’s really NOT what you think.” Well, no one listened to him, did they? If that was JMo and Colin doing something in the moment that felt right, or they had them try something that wasn’t scripted but in the ended didn’t work cause well . . . it wasn’t scripted – it would make sense that it didn’t make it in and Adam’s tweet makes complete sense.
Along the same lines (and this is the part I don’t like posting) they know the media and fans are happily snapping away when they film. What if they have decided to just allow all these pictures to end up out there and let them be. Kind of like “You want spoilers? Fine, have spoilers. You want to know what happens in advance. Fine figure out what happens in advance.” Because, really, they don’t OWE us spoilers. They don’t OWE us an explanation for every picture we see. They don’t have to explain to us which spoiler pictures they may or may not be using, which are authentic, which are BTS, etc. So I guess I’m not saying that A and are are lying about anything but I think they may be attempting to let people realize what can happen when they get too exuberant about spoilers and media/fan pictures. Kind of like a very strong message: have all the fun you want in your quest for spoilers, pictures, etc. but please believe us now – if you don’t hear it directly from us – do NOT believe it is happening, even if you see it. I am guessing that goes for all those actor and media interviews as well. They have said before that things get twisted around or misquoted, Adam just said they were still tweaking things AFTER they did the pre-screening for the media, the actors film things and they don’t necessarily know what is going to make it into the final version and what isn’t. I thought it was interesting that in the Wicked Special Ginny said that until the episode was filmed neither she nor Lana understood WHY the Evil Queen hated Snow so much so they watched the episode and cried together and then it affected how they acted together from then on out. So even the actors don’t always know MAJOR things in advance so they don’t always know when it might not be appropriate to go with the way something might feel right in the moment when they are filming something.
Know idea if I am right or completely off base here but just some thoughts I had last night.
I PM’d you RG! Thanks for addressing this! I didn’t realize you had previously posted something when I posted my second post – didn’t want you to think I was beating a dead a horse after you had already addresses it!! Thanks again!
Oh, yeah!! There were definately LOTS of CS moments. I can’t wait to go back and do my rewatch because that’s when I pick up all the little nuances.
I have no problem at all with people enjoying moments of their own ship in the chat if they can do it respectfully and maturely, and within reason. I typically try to stay away from saying much at all about CS or even Hook because I know some people take things the wrong way and I don’t want to be the person that opens a can of worms. Sadly the chat is always comprised of SF folks so what they don’t seem to understand is that we ALWAYS have to feel that way while they are able to say whatever they want.
So during an episode, great – be happy and rejoice if there is a SF moment that makes you giddy. But don’t start talking about how the entire episode is CLEARLY devoid of any CS moments, don’t make gagging sounds and say you’re hiding your eyes when you see Emma and Hook together, don’t start talking about how Hook’s master plan is to poison and gut the entire cast (“sorry, that’s just a theory – it’s what we do here”). I’m QUITE certain if we started chatting that we believed Neal had planned all along to curse the town, kill Rumple and Belle, and steal Henry away from Emma and Regina and kept repeating it over and over again we would be ganged up on and told to stop. But no one seems to have a problem when that happens to us. It’s just common courtesy and maturity.
So in the “safety” of our little ship, I didn’t see the major SF moments that the SF folks are rejoicing over AT ALL, but I would NEVER say that in the chat. Sorry, but to me that’s like saying to someone – you’re delusional. I have my own theory about what Neal is going to do but the SF folks won’t like it so I don’t talk about it in the chat out of respect for the fact that I know they love his character and their ship – I’m being respectful and courteous.
I’m here!! Had to get my son to bed and ready for his school state standardized testing tomorrow right after the episode!
I’m so glad that we have OUaT episodes to talk about again!
First, I LOVED the Wicked is Coming Special (although I don’t know why they called it that – there were about ten hot seconds of WWW). I said in the chat that it was actually really nice to NOT deal with any shipping for a bit and just be reminded of why I fell in love with show in the first place. I got teary eyed and cried at about five different places.
With that said – I actually think the special was hard to top for me! I usually have to go back and watch the episode again before I can post detailed thoughts, but I am just so happy to have the show back again that I couldn’t help but to love it!!
The one thing I did not like but I don’t think there is really any way around this is that the whole thing felt incredibly rushed to me. It would have been nice to see more of Emma and Henry’s life in NYC, more of the history of how Emma and monkey-man ended up together, etc. Also, Emma getting her memories back was way to fast for me. It seems like they kept hyping up how Hook was going to have to work so hard to get her to believe him enough to trust him and it just seemed like it happened really fast. But, again, I think this was the episode they had to use to get everything set up to tell the story so they didn’t have much choice.
Can I just say how much I LOVE Colin. I thought he did such a great job in this episode because he played things very subtly. I know the SF folks are going on about how he has decided to become a villain again. Really? Could you NOT tell what was going on. The poor guy lands in a field in the EF with all these people who he has gotten to know because of EMMA but who are NOT his family. He literally has NO ties to anyone there except the people who are going to remind him of the woman he is desparately in love with and believes he will never see again – after he was finally able to let go of the woman he loved who died 300 years ago!!! He was in pain missing the woman he loved for 300 YEARS, now he realizes that he has lost his TRUE LOVE for what he believes is forever. Just like Emma does, he has thrown his walls back up and is shutting everyone out all over again. He knows that he is going to think of her everyday for the rest of his life and he is trying to find the way to survive that misery – which for him is to escape back to his ship and being “the pirate” again. Being the hero DID work for him, he just thinks it’s going to be too painful to survive continuing to live that way because he only knows how to do it with Emma.
Then you have the poor guy get to NYC and attempts TLK thinking it might work and when it doesn’t he assumes that mean that Emma doesn’t love him. He doesn’t KNOW the history of TLK and memory loss. So know the poor man is dealing with the love of his life right in front of him, believing she doesn’t love him. When she gets her memories back he discovers that she has been seriously dating someone else and she doesn’t appear to even care about him. But why would she? He has been thinking about her every day for a year and she has been seriously dating another guy – seriously enough to tell the guy that she loves him. She has JUST gotten her memories back and is not yet used to “being both” yet. It’s gonna take her some time to figure out what’s going on. And now Emma’s walls are going to go flying back up again. But poor Killian, the look on his face when he recognized that she was dating someone and suggested that maybe she loved someone in her real life. And the look on his face in her apartment when she is talking about Walsh.
So it will be interesting to see what happens now. They are obviously trying to make you wonder if Hook is up to something and they are trying to make you wonder if Neal is up to something.
I loved the Regina and Snow moment – that was very sweet. And my favorite line of the episode? Hook to Henry: “Why are YOU dressed like THAT?”
I am definately going to have to stay out of the chat though. It was really fun during the Wicked is Coming special. And I can honestly say that 99% of the people in the chat are very kind and respectful but there is one particular person who is so incredibly immature, rude, and purposely disrespectful it is completely ridiculous. I’m sorry but I am way too old to deal with that. It has gone on way too long and that person should be kicked out. Sitting in a chat and announcing that you aren’t getting any CS vibes over and over but are getting SF feels out the wazoo when you know there are CS people in the chat is attempting to purposely annoy CS folks to the point that they will stay out of the chat. And if moderators aren’t able to tell that that isn’t any different than a CS person announcing in the chat “I don’t see how anyone could possibly see ANY SF in this episode, it’s clearly all CS” I’m stunned, it’s just a matter of wording. To CS folks, we feel like we are being told we are stupid, that we are being trolled and purposely trying to be annoyed and riled up so we will stay away from the chat. And continually bashing someone else’s ship and character and then following it up with “It’s just a theory, that’s what we do here” is like insulting someone and then saying “oh, but nothing personal.” I normally do not get bothered by things like this but this is completely ridiculous. When you have a large group of very active participants on this site who feel that they can’t participate in the chat because of ONE person that is a problem. I was really hopeful during the special tonight, then that person ruined it for me once again! I will now stop ranting.
20. He annoying jumps up and down on Emma’s bed even though he continually falls off and bumps his head
21. He’s a big tipper at the NYC monkey street performer show.
22. He has an affinity for quoting ‘See no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.’
