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Liked:

• Seeing Bandit Snow made me realize how much I miss her strength without all of the annoying-ness. She was awesome and I want to see more.

• Neal, I’m gonna miss you, Bro.

• Hook. I am really liking him, now. It’s taken me a while, but he has been elevated from “Kill Him” to “Eh, You’re Okay”.

• Emma had some very nice scenes this episode.

• Rumpel’s sass and one liners (even if his actions at the end weren’t well written to his character) My favorite: *smacks mouth* “What the hell am I doing here?”

• Emma saving Marian. If Outlaw Queen is going to prosper, it cannot be because Regina killed Robin’s wife, and mother of his son. That isn’t okay. The truth has to come out, and it has to be dealt with.  If anything, OutlawQueen shippers should be rejoicing, because if things stayed the way that they were, and Robin found out that Regina put Marian to death, that ship would cease to be (or would live on in terrible, forced writing). And no, just killing Marian again is not the answer. It’s bad writing that makes things easy (like killing Neal). Besides, I felt sorry for Marian, and it kind of made my heart sink knowing that she was supposed to be executed and was never to see her young child and husband again. It was tragic, and I like that she lives, if even to just hear her baby boy say “Mama”.

 

Disliked:

• The Rumbelle Wedding. I feel bad. I do, but it was awful. This is my ship, and it’s getting more and more difficult to ship it. Their relationship is going down the tubes if some serious enlightenment doesn’t go on. Rumpel, while, I feel that him lying to kill Zelena(without covering it up with a proposal) is understandable, I was hoping (and expecting) that he would stop the wedding and tell Belle the truth before she signed her love away on a lie. Of course, that didn’t happen, because the writers just can’t find the time to write in a suitable redemption for any of the villains without having them go back to their scheming ways almost on a dime.

• The mantle of guilt is passed to Emma. While, I understand that Emma was wrong for tainting the past, I do not like the writers putting in Regina saying that Emma doesn’t understand consequences just like her mother. Number one, I refuse to accept the guilt trip that Snow had to go through being put on Emma now. Number two, that is extremely hypocritical, because Emma could turn around and say that losing the person you love when your evil is prevented, is what happens when you kill people and rob them of their loves for your selfish bloodlust . The writers can’t keep making Regina say these high and mighty things that make no sense for her to say. It bothers me.

• Rumpel, the OOC Imp was fun, but still OOC. It seemed that the writers had things mixed up here. Rumpel after redemptive death is acting like Rumpel before redemptive death (letting Belle base their bond on a lie). Rumpel before redemptive death is acting like Rumpel after redemptive death (He didn’t ask about the time spell to go back and fix things with his son, he didn’t make any deals, and he immediately drank the memory potion as if the death of Nealfire was no sweat.)

• So…Season 1 didn’t really happen? This is more me feeling that going back in time as a plot could have been used more…usefully…than going back and making me relive season 1, but changing it.

• I do NOT want evil Regina back. It is now annoying. She better not turn against the town again.

• I’m sad that Regina’s sad…but we all know that this is A and E we’re talking about, and the minor PoC is getting the axe for  some reason or other. (Ugh…I shudder at this, but it’s so true).

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However, while I feel most people deserve redemption and opportunity to grow and change, I think that people should also be held accountable for their deeds and face the consequences of their actions.  That is where I have trouble with Regina becoming the bearer of the strongest white magic. It’s way too much and far too soon.  Actually, I don’t think Regina or Rumple should ever be capable of white magic.  Through her use of dark magic, Regina has gotten everything and I actually found it rich that she would lecture both Rumble and Zelena about seeking revenge,  especially since Regina is now good because she got her son and a new love (Robin).  Her experience shows the exact opposite.  If Zelena had killed Henry you know Regina would want revenge as well.

I completely agree, sweetgrass. 

I’m really happy that I wasn’t the only one completely thrown by Regina ever wielding light magic. And I’m glad that someone else believes that both Regina and Rumpel should never reach that point of purity. (I sometimes feel so alone here. My opinion always feels fairly unpopular. 🙁 ) After massacring people, manipulating lives, killing kids, etc, I agree that they really don’t deserve that type of purity, and it’s just bad writing to fit it in so soon if at all.)

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Interesting. That’d be a new way to go about things. Regina becoming good to the point that she uses questionable means to exercise her newfound “goodness”.

Even if we’re both wrong, I feel that something is up that we all are going to either be extremely pleased, or extremely p-o’ed to see.

I just can’t wait; I’m so giddy! Honestly, I just enjoy when Once really surprises me in any way. I feel like it’s coming. Something bigger than a simple resurrection of  Zelena. I want to be shocked. My body is ready. XD

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It sounds as if Regina wanted an alibi. Who’s to say Regina gave Belle the real dagger?

 

Oooh. I like you. You think of crazy things that get my brain going. >:D

Hmm. Brainstorming time. What reason do you think Regina would want to keep the dagger for? Maybe she knew Rumpel would try something, and so made a fake Zelena, and kept his dagger to maintain control. That’s why Zelena shattered like glass. Regina could be pulling the strings like some crazy Godfather! I don’t want evil Regina again (please, no. It’s too much). But if we have to have it, this would be awesome.

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To PriceofMagic:

I don’t agree with this because it makes it seem like the most important thing is not upsetting Regina rather than letting Rumple express his emotions in a way that doesn’t involve murder.

Oh no, ma’am! 😀 If you’ve seen my other posts, you will know that I care nothing about upsetting Regina. In fact, I was one of the first to bring that type of thing up after Cora’s death.

I put that there from the point of view of Belle. Though she doesn’t like Regina, the Mayor Mills would possibly start an all out feud with Rumpel if he murdered Zelena. That is not my opinion, but a statement I could see Belle making out of want for less fighting. Nevertheless, Regina is not the focus of the post or even that sentence. She was merely an add on in to that sentence, because I was trying to think of things Belle could say (without completely breaking character) while making a list of why her opinion was viable (naming off who all it would effect). I could omit Regina’s name from the sentence and it will still have the same meaning. Furthermore, the points are not listed in order of importance. They are just as what I said they were to be in my post: Things to discuss. Notice that I even bolded what was most important to discuss which was in the middle of the list, and had to do with Baelfire.

So, I encourage you to not even dwell on that sentence, or have it skew your view of my post, because her name is literally .05% of the conversation that I’d planned out, and it’s purpose combined.

But you are completely right in one respect. Regina shouldn’t be mentioned. That’s a big flaw, and mentioning her would probably upset him more, I realize. I’ve omitted those last few words from the sentence, to make a more congruent argument. Thanks a bunch.

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To RumplesGirl

I have a question, having read the newest responses. If Belle is being naive in what she’s asking of Rumple, then what could she have asked that would be fair to the grief and trauma Rumple is going through but also not murder?

Alright, here comes another super long, and detailed post. (Forgive me, all).

Just to be clear, I will say now that I don’t Rumpel tricking Belle is not Belle’s fault, and it’s not really her responsibility make sure that what Rumpel does is on the straight and narrow. I am just presenting  a scenario that would build Belle’s character higher than cheerleader status, and be something they could have both done. But, hey. Plot it plot. Rumpel is Rumpel. Belle is Belle. So, it didn’t happen (*is unexpectedly very sad about the lack of permanent development from either of them*)

The biggest issue with their relationship has always been their skewed views of each other. Rumpel views Belle as a naive butterfly, when we’ve seen that she can be quite strong and clever. Belle sees Rumpel to be a broken saint, incapable of turning completely to evil, when we’ve seen that he can be the cruelest being in existence. Ironically, it’s these misconceptions of each other that cause Rumpel and Belle to present themselves in ways that fuel their misconceptions of each other! XD

So, honestly, the only thing that Belle and Rumpel could have done from the start was sit down and talk to each other (immediately after Rumpel betrayed Belle’s trust with the Wraith, and before they were separated again and again) and gain clear views of who they both are, and deal with it.  Haha. 😀

However what they could have immediately done is this.

1. Comfort Rumpel. I kind of hated that there was no comfort from Belle, after all was said and done, only a moral (which is such a heavy flaw in the writing that limits Belle to nothing more than Rumpel’s flimsy conscience, but that’s another story).  There was no “I’m sorry that your son died” like when Bae wasn’t actually dead. There was only “Don’t do evil. I trust you”.  Belle should have first encouraged Rumpel to stay with her, and speak about what’s occurred, and show/tell him that he’s not crazy or evil for feeling the way that he does.  Let the dude grieve a little, but do not let him leave.

2. Think about what needs to be done next. Rumbelle tends to waste precious time, instead of helping things when there is a chance. She can’t just let him roam the streets. Belle is smart. She should have thought of a plan to calm him (because Belle is way too intelligent to completely fall for his lies about being fine after all that’s happened).

3. Only after allowing a bit of silence, comfort and grief, they should have spoken to each before about important things before the passing of the dagger. 

They should have discussed:

• What is okay to feel, but should not be done for the sake of peace.
• The meaning of Neal’s sacrifice, and how killing Zelena would affect the remaining aspects that Neal truly loved about his papa.
• What Rumpel believes is right.
• Why he believes this is right.
• What his plans are. She should plainly ask him. Rumpel speaks in loopholes, but doesn’t usually outright lie to Belle. She can read between the lines.
• Whether he hints at killing Zelena or not, she should ask him how killing her would be honoring Bae.
• Most importantly: Ask him if Bae would feel honored by her murder. It makes it harder for him to shrug it off.
• Belle should not tell Rumpel that the evil “isn’t him” as she usually does. That’ll just send off a light in his head that tells him that once again Belle is only seeing him as what she wants to see him as. It’s not comforting, nor productive. Rather, she should tell him that this person is what he doesn’t have to be. That there is always a choice, and in choosing a darker path he could very well get what he wants for now, but would likely end up losing further things that he loves. (i.e. Belle, herself)
• Belle should discuss her own discomfort with Rumpel having more blood on his hands, and take a firm stand about it. No bending. She should make it clear and present that she doesn’t agree with murder, and will not be fooled.
• In conclusion, the bulk of the conversation has to circle back, always, to where his mindset is. Whatever talk of goodness she has with him has to be incorporated into the reason for his grief, and must always come across as understanding not condoning.

There would probably be lots yelling and opposition from Rumpel, but that conversation would need to occur before Belle even allowed him to touch the dagger.

5. Finally, Belle could give him the dagger, not anymore hinting at her expectation when he has it, no longer implying a promise. After the entire session of crying/discussing/arguing/etcetera, she should give it to him with a simple “I love you.” and a meaningful look. That’s that.  It would hurt like a mother, but she’d have to trust him silently, thus not feeding much into his view of a naive girl that doesn’t understand true pain or struggle. She would show that she does understand him, and make it much more difficult for him to simply swat her opinion away (as he often has).

Belle would have done all that she could do while allowing Rumpel to make his own decisions. Rumpel does what he does, mostly when he fools himself into thinking that it is for the best. Many times it’s implied that he also lies or kills when he doesn’t think that Bae or Belle know or understand what they want. However, that perception of Bae ended when he became a man and stood firm in his convictions. If Belle shrugged off her role as a fortune cookie of  “do good” advice, it would be just what the doctor ordered. She would do this, while also agreeing to the fact that his grief and anger is completely real.

It might not have stopped Rumpel from killing Zelena, but it would have made the chances just slightly slimmer. Nothing short of wielding the dagger would completely stop him. However, it would make it difficult for him to betray her, Bae and himself. 

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Actually, Grimmsistr, I partially agree with you.

He shouldn’t be left to rage. I suppose I worded it in a strange way. For example, when Regina was out for Snow’s blood, Snow was gaurded heavily, meaning that Regina could not kill her. However, when Snow confronted Regina, it was always made clear that Regina’s misery and anger was a normal reaction, before she was told that killing Snow was wrong (by other people). That is what I mean. Intercept his plans as he tries them, (This should include Belle taking a firm stand with him) while also giving him a moment to simply exist without having what he shouldn’t be doing foisted upon him.

But this is where our opinions branch off.

Especially coming from Regina, telling him this right off is not a form of love. I have seen morality used as a defensive mechanism. It’s not comforting. It’s not something to say to someone in that situation in the way that it’s said to him. It’s hypocritical and insensitive.

For example:
If someone is religious, and their mother is killed in a church. The last thing they want to hear from the athiest to their left after that is “Only terrible ungodly people would be angry right now”. (No, I’m not anti-religion. I am religious, just giving an example)

That is just not the way to speak to anyone in that situation. Especially the way it was worded by Regina (who would rip Zelena’s face off if she killed Henry), it was very patronizing and obnoxious from the viewpoint of someone who had just lost half of everything.

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I’m sorry, but I don’t care that he lied to Belle.   Hold your pitchforks and hear me out.
I…kind of no longer care about the lying to Belle part. I hate that Rumpel covered his lie with a proposal (which is despicable), but I honestly don’t think that making a loophole in his promise so that he could kill Zelena matters as much (in this situation) as people think it does. I feel it’s more of the type of show that Once is, ingrained more in superficial, and abnormal feats of morality and forgiveness, that makes us focus more on the least meaningful part of what is actually a really understandable reaction.

1. Rumpel had to live a year of enslavement to Mrs.Psycho-Crazy. A year in enslavement, while attempting to desperately sort through the madness in his own mind to save his dying child…that he was holding within his own body. Can one even imagine holding your dying loved one for a year within yourself while being treated like a dog, and then your first moment of clarity is your loved one’s death?

2. Rumpel has busted his butt for hundreds of years just to see Nealfire again.

3. Regina was going to let Zelena live in close proximity to him and everyone else for “blah” reason, and he was expected to immediately forgive her for her extensive part in his trauma. Not to mention, Zelena was going to potentially become one of the many “redeemed” villains of Storybrooke, just waltzing around, never more than a couple streets from his home. Rumpel would have had to see, experience, and tolerate Zelena every day. Knowing Zelena, she’d probably taunt him for it, too. I’m sure that all of this must have been running through his head.

4. Rumpel’s sacrifice and redemption only pertained to Neal and Belle, not the town. Neal even said it himself. Perhaps, had Rumpel lived and Zelena never appeared, his heart would open to the others and his true redemption could begin, but Rumpel’s ideals were understandably shattered when (what he percieved to be) the only good thing he’d ever done, was completely turned on it’s head, resulting in the death of one half of his list of important people. He doesn’t care about the lie, and character wise, he probably shouldn’t. So far, in Rumpel’s eyes, he has been given the ultimate middle finger for trying to be a nice person. Though, I can’t excuse any other time he’s flopped over to the bad side, at this point, his mindset of  “It’s too hard to be good” is understandable.

5. Mind you this is perhaps the first few hours at the most, that he has been able to express himself in a year. This reaction is an immediate and primal need for some semblance of justice in his own eyes. Something that occurs to everyone, including people who lose loved ones in less extreme situations. With the coupling of his enslavement, he’s had no time to process anything. All he’s done is plan to take out one person. That person loses power, and like a spring, he’s on them, ripping out their throat like an animal. It’s all understandable here, and shouldn’t be coupled with his previous actions at all. I’m sorry, but I give him a pass.

Granted, I don’t condone Rumpel lying to Belle in any of the other situations that he has. It’s terrible that he manipulated her trust in those moments when it wasn’t even close to an understandable thing to do. I also do expect some serious consequence in their relationship for what he’s done now (possibly to the point of ending it). But, I just think that all of the crap that has occurred to Rumpel over such a short period, is just being taken despicably lightly by other “pure” characters who have, and/or have shown/told that they would kill someone for messing with their kids. If there was time for Rumpel to rage a bit, and everyone left him be, while giving him the “I understand you, but it’s also wrong” spiel (as they usually do) I’d be fine. However, the moment he’s finally out of Zelena’s clutched, the disgustingly hypocritcal message given by everyone is immediately shoved down his throat as if they would never sin in such a way. “Oh yeah, she played a huge part in murdering your son, and you didn’t even get to go to his funeral. Oh, well. Just forgive her now. It’s not like she made your life a living hell just now or anything. She’s going to be your neighbor soon, so suck it up.”

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Favorite:

• Dorothy! I really like her.  She seems like a really plain, and ordinary teen girl, and I like that. She’s so lovable.
• Belle stands up for herself! Even if she gets knocked out, I love it.
• Rumpel drags Zelena across the ground. Can we get a full gif of that?
• Belle giving Rumpel the dagger back, and trusting him.
• Rumbelle proposal!!! I am so slap happy!…And simultaneously afraid and aggravated. (See least favorites below.)
• Mixed feelings about Zelena being spared by Regina. I like that Regina is doing this, I just think that in the long haul, it was going to prove itself to be a stupid decision.

Least Favorite: 

• Rumpel, you are SCREWING your redemption. I was just happy about the proposal and you botch it. Man, can the writers make you stop fishtailing? Killing Zelena? Okay, fine with that. I would do the same. Lying to Belle and then proposing to her almost as a distraction? Are you out of your cotton picking MIND!?

• Oz looks very Enchanted Forest-y.

• Regina telling Rumpel (in so many words) to just get over his son’s death. Had she worded it in a different way, that at least conveyed that she understood, I’d be fine, but the way she told him off was just…obnoxious.

• Gold is right. She can’t be serious.

• I completely agree with Emma. There was nothing warranting Hook to be required to go with her, other than to rehash the same conversation that we’ve heard fifty times now (Yes, Emma. We know that it bothers you that you left New York.) , and also because… Plot Device! Ugh…Especially considering the fact that Hook had momentarily lost everyone’s trust, there is even less reason that Charming would require Hook to go with Emma to check anything out. Furthermore, Emma is right. Hook is a completely normal, one handed man. Emma implied that Hook would only weigh her down…which turned out to be exactly what he did. What is the point of that? I dunno, so that Regina can be the only one left to preform shiny light powers?

• Regina is the only one who can preform shiny light powers. Okay, I’m all for Regina redemption. When done right, and cooked to perfection, mwah! Love it. However, light magic had been shown to be a big thing. And I don’t buy for a second that Regina, Queen of Fishtailing, just decided to be good so hard that she is able to perform pure light magic. If her dark magic came out, laced with light, I would believe it, but her just saying “I’m different” and BOOM! She’s pure? I’ve got serious issues. Even with RH holding her heart, it’s still a heart that’s black as coal. And their love is still completely newfound. I don’t buy completely pure light magic coming from that. I just hope that she’s not able to perform light magic regularly now. That would just be too much.

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Something about the second sneak peek is bothering me.

“Two pure hearts”, Glinda says.

I may just be a forgetful person, but since when is the black spot of doom on Snow’s heart that was hyped up forever, nonexistent? Are they going to touch on this?

One does not simply “get over” a blackened heart.

[Author]

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