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Slurpeez wrote: Neal,
Who according to A and E, got his happy ending
Well, you of all people know that’s a joke
Slurpeez wrote: Ariel, Wendy, Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella, Ruby, Archie, Dr. Whale All of these people got their happy endings (maybe not Dr. Whale…?) and have often come back to the show. They are not treated like props to be disposed of when the show is done. They keep coming back or being referenced in order to flesh them out more. Even recently, Ella was mentioned in passing. When was the last time we heard about Rapunzel?
But my point was those “happy endings” were also rushed, sloppy and only served to prop up the core 6 characters. I’m not justifying the lack of racial diversity. My point though is that every secondary character is just a prop. The lack of diversity and the treatment of minority characters won’t improve until (1) the writers learn how to incorporate past characters (e.g. Lancelot, Mulan) and/or (2) cast a POC as a new regular next season (e.g. Aladin and Jasmine)
[adrotate group="5"]"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
In one episode where they were literally prop and filler characters. Her parents said maybe 5 words? Rapunzel was only there to prop up Charming’s story.
Please don’t misunderstand me. I acknowledge it was a short and quick story that was really more about Charming than Rapunzel. But so was Tinkerbell’s story really short and mostly more about Regina. So was Ariel’s story really short and used to flesh out more of Snow White, and later, Belle. So my point isn’t that there are tons of POC getting long, drawn-out happy endings…clearly, they’re not (and that’s problematic). Rather, my point was that there are tons of secondary characters who’re only used for one or a few episodes to flesh out the main characters. And that’s the real shame. It’s a shame there aren’t more PoC who’re regulars. As I wrote, A&E had a real chance to bring in a new character who was a PoC after Neal was killed, but instead brought in Will Scarlet, a white man. The shortcoming of the writers is two-fold: (1) shiny toy syndrome and (2) lack of racial diversity among the core cast.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
PoC characters get disposed of proportionately far more often than white characters. I’d wager this is true of wider television too(it’s certainly true of queer characters).
Too true. Mulan was the gay Asian woman on the show, and even she got written out. Case in point.
Does it happen to every white character? (and honestly after this question I shouldn’t have to ask more to show the difference in how the two sets of people are being treated) We’ve had plenty of example of white characters getting fulfilling happy endings. We’ve had one PoC get hers and it was in one episode and then she was instantly shuffled off to the side.
Actually, in addition to Ursula and her dad getting their happy reunion, Rapunzel and her parents were reunited, so technically, they got their happy ending, too, and they’re POC. But yeah, that was a one-episode arc, so I see your point. But plenty of white characters have been sidelined too, (see my list above: Ariel, Wendy, Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella, Ruby, Archie, Dr. Whale, all come to mind). And despite (some) of these characters having received “happy endings” I’d hardly call them satisfying, since most of them were one-episode long.
Is the majority of our regular cast made up of white people?
I totally agree with the sentiment that the core regular cast could and should be more racially diverse! A&E had every chance to bring in a POC when Neal was killed off, but instead chose to make Will Scarlett a regular (though to what end remains a big question).
Are all those white people most likely gong to get happy endings with other white people?
Probably, but then so will all of the non-white characters like Mulan (though admittedly that pool or non-white characters is very small).
Are those minor white people fleshed out more realistically than the PoC–like Cora, Pan, Walsh, the dwarves, the BF?
Yes. The writers are totally at fault for ditching amazing characters like Mulan, who was fleshed out in 9 or episodes she appeared him, and yet we never saw her back-story just because they got the rights to Peter Pan. But I will still maintain that Mulan wasn’t the only character to suffer, since interesting characters like Ruby, Philip and Aurora were also passed over. We never saw how Mulan and Aurora were able to save Philip from the Wraith. #ShinyToySyndrome
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
However I stand by the point that it’s not just POC characters that get “disposed” of, it happens to white characters too.
I agree. As I wrote above, the show-runners of guilty of Shiny Toy Syndrome. As soon as they grow tired of their new toys, they move on to the next batch of new characters. So both white and non-white characters get passed over. How I wish these writers could simply (1) see a character arc through to its natural conclusion (2) not immediately pass over important characters as soon as a new one comes along and (3) work on diversifying their core cast of regular characters. ABC has plenty of shows (Galvant) for instance, in which the core cast is composed of a multicultural and multiracial group of actors. So the problem really is down to the show and its creators, rather than the network.
Why did they kill off Lancelot, never to be heard of again? Did the writers intend to return to his story? It seemed like the writers were going to be visiting Camelot again, but then they got the rights to Neverland, and it got passed over.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
But when they constantly squander opportunities to include PoCs in a relevant way, it is a really, really big issue. If they’d made Mulan instead of Will a regular, the fandom would have cheered. They could have given Cruella whatever she wants before Ursula. A thousand little choices that they’ve made that could add up to a more diverse and interesting cast.
Yes! The writers could do a better job of incorporating more diversity into the show in a lasting and meaningful way. To be somewhat philosophical though, it’s not only POC who suffer from what @RumplesGirl calls Shiny Toy Syndrome; these show-runners just simply don’t have a great track record of keeping ANY secondary character relevant, whether white or not (see Belle, Will Scarlett, Ruby, Cinderella, Sleeping Beauty, Wendy Darling, Ariel, Rapunzel, Mulan etc). Having said that though, I totally agree the writers could do a much better job of having a more diverse core group of actors as fairytale characters.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Slurpeez wrote: Bae’s death was still unavenged, and Rumple couldn’t do anything about it because Zelena had him cornered. Does karma only apply to Rumple and not Zelena? #SoDone
Well…hmmm…in Zelena’s defense…Rumple did try to kill her after she had begged him not to do so, not to mention she was a defenseless woman.
It’s hard for me (and Rumple/Neal fans) to forgive Zelena for killing Neal. Calling her a “defenseless woman” after she tortured Rumple and murdered his son makes it sound like she’s somehow the victim when in fact, Rumple was her victim. And while I don’t condone “an eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth” I can at least understand why Rumple was driven to try an avenge Neal’s death, which let’s face it, is the glaring white elephant in the room. Why does Zelena now have her second chance but Neal does not? Since she has been (mysteriously) resurrected, all Zelena has done so far is prove just how undeserving she is of another chance (unlike Neal who did deserve one) by killing Marian, impersonating her, and making Robin, Rumple, Roland and Regina’s lives a living hell. After all of the horrors Zelena committed she’s still unrepentant for bringing about the untimely death of Neal. That is why I said it seems unjust that karma only seems to apply to Rumple, rather than to Zelena (or the other villains for that matter).
In fact, Zelena gloating over Rumple’s dying body while he’s being kept alive on life-support and her squeezing his ventilator tube so that he can’t breath is about as low and irredeemable as a character can get. I hope Zelena meets her end soon, for good. I’m not excusing Rumple for “killing” Zelena and then lying about it to Belle, but Zelena isn’t any better than Rumple in my view, or anymore deserving of another shot at life. Unlike Regina, Zelena has demonstrated how unrepentant she is for anything. Rumple was her victim, not the other way around, and Rumple still was at her mercy in this episode when she forced him to make a deal (against his will). Now his hands are tied when it comes to Zelena because the dark one doesn’t break deals (except for that time with his son). In my book, Zelena doesn’t deserve a second chance, because she’s evidently not remorseful in any way, and I don’t wish her well.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
more to the point, how did she even become corporal again? She was a sentient life force floating around the EF…but then became all…fleshy again?
These things are best left unquestioned, since there probably is not good consistent or narrative answer. The answer from the writers is probably just some generic hand-wavy reply like “magic!” when the truth is plot!
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
I know a lot may not agree, but I fully believe A&E always intended us to see Adult Lily at some point. Everything about the episode and the way she was introduced says she was important,the scar on her wrist being the biggest clue. I dont think its poor planning at all. Lily was never intended to be a one-off character, and I think in some interviews they may have said we “might” see her again in the future and here we are now. The only thing we are asking is that a&e be consistent. They casted a young Latina to play her, they should gave casted a Latina adult actress. I’m pretty sure there is no shortage.
I agree. I pegged Lily as being an important, returning character from the instance she was introduced in 4×5 (comparable to Neal being Baelfire). There’s no way the casting department was unaware that Lily would be a returning character. It’s all the more shame then that the casting department didn’t cast someone as Adult Lily who was (1) the same heritage as the actress who played young Lily and (2) looked so different from Nicole Muñoz. If the casting department had just cast a dark-haired actress of Latino or even of Mediterranean (rather than Northern or Eastern European) heritage, then I doubt we’d be having this conversation now.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Was Cyrus even a POC? He came from Agrabah as well correct? Shouldn’t he be the same race as his mother, brothers, and Jafar? They were all POC’s but he seemed white, unless I am mistaken? That could have been a huge opportunity for them.
Actually, I was pleased to discover that Peter Gadiot, the actor who played Cyrus in WL, is part-Latino. (He was born in London, but is part Mexican, part Dutch). So while I’m glad to see a Latino had a lead role in a OUAT spin-off, it still raises the question of why a part-Mexican, part-European was (mis)cast in a role that should have gone to someone of Middle Eastern heritage (since Agrabah is of Arab origin).
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
Because we could all use a good laugh. Lily Spark’s review.
"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy
