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It comes down to something I have said many times: the difference between probability and possibility.
Anything is possible on this show. The writers can magic-handwave any storyline into existence that they so choose.
However being possible is not the same as being probably. While the possibility of Neal coming back/not being dead is high, the probability of it happening is most definitely not. It’s not only not high, it as close to zero as anything that is probable on this show can be.
[adrotate group="5"]"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"He was burried, Zelena wasnt and before people mention archie, lets not forget that archie being alive was shown on that same episode, in order to let GA know that he was alive. Zelena had nothing to link her there and she wanted revenge on Regina and she had magic, Neal had no magic, had a son and father( wont mention emma) and he didnt want revenge, so he had no reason to appear almost a year after like nothing happened and he was just on a holiday and if is true that composer thing that sets that Neal is dead. The thing is the writers didnt knew what to do with him and didnt care about him, so yeah, no Neal, especially bc the writers only see ships, so for them Neal is someone that can get bwt Cs. Also, why people keep wanting GoS to fail and MRJ back at OUAT, people should be saying even if GOS gets cancelled, MRJ deserves something better and i wish him luck, people should be wanting the cast to get free from this show. This is not GoS vs OUAT, Gos is not the thing that is in the middle of MRJ going back to ouat. The show simply doesnt want him back and to tell u the true i doubt he would want to go back at all, especially full time. Lets not forget that MRJ did 2 works for Disney after ouat, Sons of liberty on history( owned 50% by abc/disney) and finest hours, if they wanted him back, they could after all these projects bond him again to ouat, but they didnt.
A body that looked like Neal was buried. They thought that Archie was dead in his office for awhile. Cora was pretending to be half the characters on the show. Zelena pretending to be Marian. I know that some people want to pretend it is hard for Neal to be back, but it’s not even a little bit hard. Not in this show were pretty much any random thing might happen. I am not saying, he is going to be back. I don’t think they want him back, but not because it is somehow difficult for him to be back alive. Zelena disappeared for awhile before she was randomly back, wasn’t it half a season later.
Neal has every reason to appear as well. His story was not even remotely finished properly and his removal from the show has had catastrophic effect. Even if he didn’t get back with Emma, he should not have been killed off the show because of Rumpel and Henry as well as interesting conversations he could have had with Belle about Rumpel or Snow and Charming about kid Emma. Like i said, i don’t think Neal is going to be back on the show for more then a cameo at most, but not because it is somehow difficult. Not in a show where magic can do anything and characters disappear only to reappear seasons later.
It comes down to something I have said many times: the difference between probability and possibility. Anything is possible on this show. The writers can magic-handwave any storyline into existence that they so choose. However being possible is not the same as being probably. While the possibility of Neal coming back/not being dead is high, the probability of it happening is most definitely not. It’s not only not high, it as close to zero as anything that is probable on this show can be.
On a normal show, i would agree. Ouat is not a normal show. There is no rhyme or reason to the writing. I think that too many things outside of the show have to happen for Neal to come back. MRJ’s new show would have to get cancelled. He would have to want to come back. The show would have to want him to be back. I really do think that at this point they have made their choices and are going to stick with them. I am pretty sure Eddy said something like that in an interview. I don’t think he will be back, but not because the writing can’t allow it. The writing allows anything. Neal being killed proves that. If they will do that, they would do anything. Zelena being Marian and pregnant with Robins baby. If they will do that, they will do anything. This is not a good thing, but it’s the truth. They could easily just write him back in. It doesn’t have to make sense.
Neal could just not be dead quite easily. They left his body in the forest with Zelena. He could just not be dead. I understand what you are saying about MRJ being in another show, but if his show was cancelled then he could just be alive on Ouat. If Zelena can suddenly be alive again and pretending to be Marian for half a season then Neal can just be alive too.
the first time Neal could have come back was if Emma would have TLK him. this is why Rumple stood up and left them to be alone together. when he saw she was not kissing him, he wanted to do something, but as he was under Zelena’s control he COULDN’T.
the second time was when he turned Zelena into a green dusty portal opener. he HOPED that Emma would go back to the time Neal almost opened the DarkOne’s vault, and save him. bring him to the future alive. but she went to her parents meeting instead.
every time Gold hoped that Emma would act like a savior and bring back Neal, she didn’t.
Now she wants to bring back hook. well, at least he will go with her this time and try to bring Neal back himself.I bet this is the ONLY scene in season 4 where these two interact, because from what I heard, Emma and Hook barely have any scenes apart, but in this scene, it reminded me of all these interactions they had in season 1,2 and 3 and again, they were beautiful together. both the same type. desperate souls.
I absolutely love when Emma and Rumple have scenes together. I think those two parallel each other so well, especially now after Emma turned away the darkness and Rumple gave back in. If that isn’t dark vs light, good vs evil, I don’t know what is. Once again, I think the show’s “final battle” should be between these two. Their scenes together are so juicy usually and I want more of them, and not Merida and hero Rumple. Lame.
Emma became a pod person basically after 3×15 and has only descended further with each passing episode.
I have no real qualms with Emma’s character and development. Now if you wanna talk about Rumple’s flip flopiness, Snowing’s assassination, Blue Fairy’s lack of involvement, etc., well then I can’t argue with you there. But Emma and Regina’s characters are like the only sure fire ones that I don’t have an issue with as far as where they started, where they are now, and where they are going. Writing for the others is questionable at best.
Oh no, i think Emma has been really different for awhile. she’s not the same person and i know characters can grow and change, i think emma’s growth stopped after the save henry arc. like someone said previously about emma, its as if her development is going through a loop without progression, that every season she gets reset.
Emma used to be awesome. She borders on annoying sometimes, to me.
Most of the characters have shades of this nowadays to varying degrees.."I could have the giant duck as my steed!" --Daniel Radcliffe
Keeper Of Tamara's Taser , Jafar's Staff, Kitsis’s Glasses , Ariel’s Tail, Dopey's Hat , Peter Pan’s Shadow, Outfit, & Pied Cloak,Red Queen's Castle, White Rabbit's Power To World Hop, Zelena's BroomStick, & ALL MAGICOn a normal show, i would agree. Ouat is not a normal show. There is no rhyme or reason to the writing. I think that too many things outside of the show have to happen for Neal to come back. MRJ’s new show would have to get cancelled. He would have to want to come back. The show would have to want him to be back. I really do think that at this point they have made their choices and are going to stick with them. I am pretty sure Eddy said something like that in an interview. I don’t think he will be back, but not because the writing can’t allow it. The writing allows anything. Neal being killed proves that. If they will do that, they would do anything. Zelena being Marian and pregnant with Robins baby. If they will do that, they will do anything. This is not a good thing, but it’s the truth. They could easily just write him back in. It doesn’t have to make sense.
Yes, there are many things they can do but they dont want to. About Neal, yeah, see there is already a Neal on the show that is Snowing Son, the only way MRj could appear as Neal would be in flashback, which wont happen, so any full time job, doesnt even requires MRJ, they can bring young Bae and let Rumple and Belle raise him, and he would not have memories, so no problem to Cs and he could bond with Henry paralleling S3B when he didnt remenber Neal, so yeah, if they want to bring Bae, they dont even need MRJ unless for one small scene to de age him, but u see, that would have to be done on this arc, not in any other arc, but that wont happen, and even tho this option is not from my like, if would mean people would leave MRJ in peace and stop wishing that he doesnt get other jobs, so that he can return to ouat and at same time would give Bae another chance, so do it.
"I offended you with my opinion? Ha, you should hear the ones I keep to myself".
Oh no, i think Emma has been really different for awhile. she’s not the same person and i know characters can grow and change, i think emma’s growth stopped after the save henry arc. like someone said previously about emma, its as if her development is going through a loop without progression, that every season she gets reset. Emma used to be awesome. She borders on annoying sometimes, to me. Most of the characters have shades of this nowadays to varying degrees..
I think Emma stopped growing as a character after 3A. Every arc she has to accept something (Storybrooke as her home, her magic, her parents) – things that she has already accepted during season 2-3A, so what was the point?
However, Emma has changed, in my opinion season 5A has devolved her character, instead of coming out of the darkness stronger, she came out weaker.
She became obssessive with a man to the point she’s willing to endanger her family and leave Storybrooke unprotected (she’s the savior of this town, doesn’t that mean anything anymore?), all of this she does for a guy, that’s being selfish towards every other character in this show. A strong character wouldn’t have gone to the underworld, she would have delt with the loss and let her family be there for her.
"All your questions are pointless"
She became obssessive with a man to the point she’s willing to endanger her family and leave Storybrooke unprotected (she’s the savior of this town, doesn’t that mean anything anymore?), all of this she does for a guy, that’s being selfish towards every other character in this show. A strong character wouldn’t have gone to the underworld, she would have delt with the loss and let her family be there for her.
Ok, but the town isn’t in danger right now. And can you blame her for wanting to try and save someone she loves? Someone who’s death she blames herself for? As far as I know, she didn’t ask her family to come with her. They all just sort of went. I think a strong character WOULD go to the UW if she knew there was even a slight chance of saving the love of their life. Just accepting it and not trying to do anything about it, when you know there is a chance, is losing hope, which this show loves so much, and basically giving up. If she’s the savior, GO SAVE YOUR LOVE. The town is fine. I think it’s important to note that Emma being The Savior always meant she was going to save “them” (her family, friends, etc.). They all happened to be residing in storybrooke. But she is not the Savior of the town. She is the savior of the people she loves. She is going to bring the happy endings. She saved them by killing Hook. Now the town is fine. So go get your happy ending with Hook.
*sigh*
Okay. I’m gonna have to ask that everyone remember that this is the SF thread. It’s a safe haven for the SF shippers to discuss their favorite ship, their feelings on the show. It is NOT a place for non-SFers to praise CS, discuss how CS might be TL, or how much they love CS/Hook and argue against SF. That’s a rule we set up here at the forums years ago. It doesn’t fly and it causes fighting and hostility. Trying to persuade shippers of a different sort that their ship is wrong and/or that the opposite ship is palatable, acceptable or anything else does not fly inside shipping threads. It never has.
It has come time for me to remind people of the rules Matt and I have had to put into place to keep the peace. Everyone is free to read whatever threads they want. They are free to make commentary in any thread SO LONG AS it keeps the peace and does not attempt to start any sort of shipping fighting.
Over the past few pages this thread has become a hotbed of debate about why some people still watch the show if there is so much anger (implying that we all stop watching because we “hate” the show and calling our intellect and intentions into question) and is now turning into a defense of storylines that most of us feel are unpalatable. I understand the rest of the forums are currently quiet and that there is a need for conversation, however SF is not the place to *this* kind of conversation. It’s going to end badly.
Thus, I am turning off this thread for 20 mins so that everyone can see this note–and while it’s not in bold, it is most assuredly a mod note. If there is a need to have the kind of conversation that is being prompted here now, then start a new thread.
I will turn back on this thread in 20 mins and I expect that the conversation will resume in the proper manner: defense of CS or Hook or any attempt to engage in a CSF debate is not acceptable here. The same goes for any attempt to defend SF or Neal or engage in a CSF debate in the CS thread.
"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"
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