Emma + Baelfire = Swanfire

[RumplesGirl]

that’s a very interesting spoiler from BB. As far as I can remember–there are no significant CS symbol from Tallahassee. They use the bean as their ship symbol mostly and that didn’t come into play in a significant CS way until 209, right? I may be misunderstanding their symbolic interpretation, so forgive me CS lurkers. I won’t try to interpret your symbols. However, there *the* SF symbols come into existence in Tallahassee–all of them: the car, the pendent, the dreamcatcher, AND the biggest one of them all: Henry! Manhattan brings two of them back up: the dreamcatcher and the pendant. We know Emma sees the dreamcatcher. I think that means the other object is the pendant. So does Neal give it back to her? She isn’t wearing it so far as we know in the shots we have. (though it’s always hard to tell). So maybe she takes it back from Neal and says she needs time to think things through. And in the meantime, she might try life with Hook.

[Phee]

RG, you gotta tell Daniel that there are lots of spoilers quoted all over the general forum, and maybe that’ll scare him into getting the glitch fixed, (seems the forum has been updated, which I thought was meant to fix things like this, but it sure hasn’t fixed the spoiler quoting).

This is from an awesome post of Heather’s from a bunch of pages back…
It’s interesting in a way to think about this scenario. When he left Emma the first time and didn’t go search for her, he only did that because he wanted her to be with her family and because he thought she would never forgive him. If he had kept her to himself he would have kept her from her family and who knows what would have happened to them. Now he knows that she does still care about him and could possibly forgive him so there’s a hope there for him that he hasn’t had before. If he decides now not to go after her and Henry, he’s going to keep them apart from the one thing he knows she’s wanted her whole life (a family and a home). It also keeps them apart from the ONLY reason he left her in the first place. He might think at first that David and Snow are right, that she and Henry are better off happy and away from the FT craziness, but I think he’s going to realize quickly that leaving her away from her family negates the sacrifice me made when he left her all those years ago and that it will keep her in that place where she feels abandoned, unloved, and unwanted (even with Henry, those feelings don’t go away). He knows the one thing she’s always wanted in her life and I just can’t see any scenario where he decides it’s a good thing to just leave them alone and let them live those false lives when they both have families who love them and miss them. I think he’s going to do the right thing and try to figure out a way back to them (hopefully his conversation with Belle is what triggers this and also helps Snow & David realize that they don’t want to live without their daughter anymore either). How could this second part of the season be all about HOME for these characters if you seriously don’t allow one of the most tragic homeless characters have the chance and mission to get his family home?

And I just wanna say…
YES ALL OF THAT! I would imagine that it would be a confusing situation for Neal to be in, when Snowing tell him to not go after her. On the one hand, he knows they love her and want her to be happy, so maybe they have a point, it’s not like they’re coming at this from a heartless standpoint. On the other hand, he believes that their happy ending is being together, and that’s something he wants to fight for. But on the other hand, will fighting for it just serve to upset her current, happy life. But on the other hand, like you say Heather, what he did back in the day was so Emma could be with her parents, and now she’s not with her parents, so if he sits by a does nothing to reunite them all, then what he did back in the day is null and void, all that sadness and suffering and lonliness, everything that not only he but also Emma endured over those 11 years, so Emma could be with her parents, and now she can’t be with her parents after all. Nope, Neal ain’t gonna stand for that, he’s gonna find a way to set things right and make the struggle be for something worthwhile in the end.

I also think it’s an interesting thing they’re gonna do with Snowing telling him to leave Emma be, because often you see fans declaring that Snowing should hate Neal for having left her, and yet here they are telling him not to go after her, which I think will add another layer to explaining their understanding of him. “Leave her be so she can have happiness with family,” is why Neal left her in the first place, and it’s why Snowing are telling him not to go after her now. Only difference is Neal did it so she could find her parents, and Snowing are doing it so she can live in blissful ignorance with her son. Even though Neal and Snowing are gonna be on opposing sides with this issue, they’re all still motivated by the same love for family. I’m sure they won’t be completely heartless about what they say to him, because they know what it’s like to give up a child, and that’s what Neal has just done. If Snow’s gonna empathise with Regina over that, I’d think she can empathise with Neal over it as well. Basically…it’s complicated, and layered, but really, Snowing totally get Neal.

From melbell…
Emma may not say the reason she lives in New York is because of Neal because when asked, she doesn’t remember that Neal lived there. But she may say that she was drawn to New York because something in the city felt familiar. Or, she may just say New York has the best schools for Henry… we don’t know. But think about this, Emma probably doesn’t know why she decided to play “Charlie’s Girl” the morning Hook came a knocking, but that doesn’t mean that song is not connected with Neal.

My response…
YES EXACTLY! The fact that she did these things even without any conscious knowledge of why she did them, I think is a deliberate thing to show that no matter what, Emma and Neal are always connected.

Also from melbell…
And I think that while Neal is looking or making his way back to Henry and Emma, the writers are going to focus a lot of his story with his Father and how they work together now that they have repaired their relationship. I loved how they worked together in 3×04 and Rumple and Neal still have a lot to learn about each other. That relationship is one I think Adam and Eddy really want to see grow, and I for one would love to see the two of them trusting each other and working towards a common goal through a longer period of time- without the whole “Rumple trying to kill Henry” thing. How much fun would it be to see Rumple asking Neal how he learned how to do certain things and to see them bond! And if this relationship is being explored, then it makes sense that we haven’t really seen much of MRJ filming with everyone else.

My response…
A bunch of pages back I posted a long, rambling, potential headcanon thing, that included Neal being imprisoned by Zelena, along with Rumple, but I didn’t really think about the opportunity that would present for them to really get into the father/son relationship until I read your post. Now I really want Neal to be taken prisoner by Zelena. You’re right, melbell, it would be a perfect opportunity for them to show Neal and Rumple working together and learning about each other. We saw a bit of it in NL, but now that the threat to Henry from Rumple is no more, and now that Neal has seen the bravery from Rumple when he stabbed himself to save them, Neal sees his father in a whole new light, and I’d LOVE to see that explored by having them work together to escape Zelena and get back to their loved ones. Yes, I NEED THIS.

[Slurpeez]

RumplesGirl wrote: So does Neal give it back to her? She isn’t wearing it so far as we know in the shots we have. (though it’s always hard to tell). So maybe she takes it back from Neal and says she needs time to think things through. And in the meantime, she might try life with Hook.

I’m not sure about the “trying life with Hook” bit, but I agree that the main symbols in both Manhattan and Tallahassee are the dreamcatcher and the pendant, the objects which Neal and Emma, respectively, held onto for over a decade. We know *for sure* that the dreamcatcher is going to come into play again, and I’m predicting, so will the swan pendant. I suppose it’s possible that the yellow bug is the second object besides the dreamcatcher, but I doubt it, because that’s not really a spoiler; we already know Emma drove away from SB in the yellow bug. So, I think this second spoiler-y object that reappears is the swan pendant. We can be reasonably sure that cursed Emma rediscovers the dreamcatcher in Emma’s apartment. The “how” the swan pendant comes into play (assuming it does) is less clear.  I don’t think Emma is going to meet Neal again in 3×12 (but I’d be happy to be proven wrong on this). So I think the way Emma comes across the swan pendant is either she finds it in Neal’s apartment (where he put it for safe-keeping after she returned it to him in Manhattan). The other possibility is that Neal has the swan pendant in the EF and he gives it to Hook to pass along to Emma, so as to convince her that Hook knows Neal. Emma would have no “reasonable” explanation as to why some pirate has her swan pendant when the last thing Emma probably recalls about it is Neal sending it to her in the mail.

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

[Phee]

Regarding the pendant, if it DOES make an appearance in 312, it’s always been my headcanon that Neal had it in his pocket and was clutching it when the Curse cloud hit, so he still has it with him in FTL. If so, I could imagine a scene, after Snowing have told him not to go after her, where he’s having a moment to himself, and he pulls out the pendant to look at it. Maybe they can cut to that right after the scene of Emma and the dream catcher. Maybe that can be the moment when Belle walks up to speak to him. Anyway, however it happens, if that swan pendant really does appear in 312, I’ll be over the fricking moon.

[RumplesGirl]

RG, you gotta tell Daniel that there are lots of spoilers quoted all over the general forum, and maybe that’ll scare him into getting the glitch fixed, (seems the forum has been updated, which I thought was meant to fix things like this, but it sure hasn’t fixed the spoiler quoting).

LOL. And here goes email #4 to Daniel in less than 3 days.

Basically…it’s complicated, and layered, but really, Snowing totally get Neal.

Absolutely They get that Neal wants to go after Emma right away but they say, “no. We need to give her–what’s that–HER BEST CHANCE.” But this time, it’s not her best chance to find them, but her best chance to have a normal life, the one thing Emma has always wanted. I really wanna see what Snowing say to Hook cause it sounds like he’s on a horse getting ready to flee.

I don’t think Emma is going to meet Neal again in 3×12 (but I’d be happy to be proven wrong on this)

I’m not sure either. It doesn’t sound like there is a SF reunion in this episode. But I honestly think the ending is just Hook, Emma, and Henry arriving in SB and that’s it. 312 is a beginning of the Wicked arc but it’s more of a stand alone in which we focus on the aftermath of 311.

 

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[heatherc1275]

I swear I was on my way to bed but I checked here real quick before that and had a random thought about something you guys mentioned from Barbara’s chat.

What if how we see the pendant again is just a simple scene of Neal in the EF with it? He’s feeling sad and lonely after his discouraging talk with Snowing about finding Emma, he’s not sure what he wants to do anymore, and because he misses her and Henry so much, he simply pulls the pendant out of his pocket or satchel to try to feel close to her again. He’s sitting there staring at it when Belle finds him and then they have their own talk about finding their loved ones. I can’t imagine any reasonable scenario where anyone BUT Neal gives that necklace back to Emma so I’d rather see something like this if we’re going to see the pendant again without a SwanFire reunion. That symbol is too big for their relationship for anyone else to be part of it.

I really am going to bed now, LOL 😉

 

#MoreBOOMLessGloom

[RumplesGirl]

Heather wrote What if how we see the pendant again is just a simple scene of Neal in the EF with it? He’s feeling sad and lonely after his discouraging talk with Snowing about finding Emma, he’s not sure what he wants to do anymore, and because he misses her and Henry so much, he simply pulls the pendant out of his pocket or satchel to try to feel close to her again. He’s sitting there staring at it when Belle finds him and then they have their own talk about finding their loved ones. I can’t imagine any reasonable scenario where anyone BUT Neal gives that necklace back to Emma so I’d rather see something like this if we’re going to see the pendant again without a SwanFire reunion. That symbol is too big for their relationship for anyone else to be part of it.

argknbflkbjfbjfidjr3tu4tbfjkbnewkm!

I didn’t need that pain!

GAH. Ouch. it hurts!

Let me hug him!!

Headcanon: accepted

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Phee]

RG, I totally think that Snowing are gonna say the same thing to Hook about going after Emma, but he’s not gonna even stop for 2 seconds to take what they say into consideration at all.

Heather, agreed about the pendant being just between the two of them, and it shouldn’t go through anyone else’s hands. If they do show it in 312 at all, that’s like a big, screaming, neon beacon that SF’s story isn’t done. Going off the spoilers we’ve got, it seems like there’s gonna be some setup for future SF interactions, and showing the pendant with Neal in FTL (and the dream catcher with Emma) would be a perfect way to do that.

[RumplesGirl]

I totally think that Snowing are gonna say the same thing to Hook about going after Emma, but he’s not gonna even stop for 2 seconds to take what they say into consideration at all.

Greaaaaaaaaaaat. Cause what this fandom needs is more things to fight over. “He’s fighting for her happiness!” “His disregarding her parents and her happy ending!” Blah blah blah. But in my opinion, if Hook’s doing that it’s not *for* Emma, but for himself. He thinks Emma is his second chance and he wants HIS happiness. Letting Emma be happy, even if it’s without you, that’s sacrifice. And true love is also sacrifice

"He was a lot of things to me" "The only conclusion was love"

[Slurpeez]

Heather wrote: What if how we see the pendant again is just a simple scene of Neal in the EF with it?

You’re probably right. The simplest answer is often the correct one. What a lovely thought!

Phee wrote: Regarding the pendant, if it DOES make an appearance in 312, it’s always been my headcanon that Neal had it in his pocket and was clutching it when the Curse cloud hit, so he still has it with him in FTL. If so, I could imagine a scene, after Snowing have told him not to go after her, where he’s having a moment to himself, and he pulls out the pendant to look at it. Maybe they can cut to that right after the scene of Emma and the dream catcher. Maybe that can be the moment when Belle walks up to speak to him. Anyway, however it happens, if that swan pendant really does appear in 312, I’ll be over the fricking moon.

Oh, what a beautiful theory, Phee! I was doing summersaults trying to think of how Emma could get the SF pendant back already, but of course, Neal probably has it in his pocket! Just because the SF pendant may come into play doesn’t mean Emma has it back; it might just be revealed that Neal has always kept it with him on his person. *SF Feels!*

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

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