I believe Bae is Peter Pan & Henry’s father.

[TheGoldenKey]

I believe the connection between Baelfire & Morraine have more to do with it being a nod to the book series Wheel of Time. Here is a link that describes Moraine (a heroine) and Balefire (a weapon to erase time). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wheel_of_Time

K&H also gave nods to this in Lost. Remember the frozen wheel that would move the Island through time and space? http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Frozen_wheel

As far as the “Wendy” connection, I still believe it will be Emma. I don’t think Bae, even as Peter Pan, would have gone back to the Enchanted Forest. That would rule out visiting Morraine. Peter always came to the real world, a world without magic. In the movie Hook, Moira (Peter’s wife) was Wendy’s grand daughter. Moria was the reason Peter left Neverland and stayed in the real world. In my mind, this has to be Emma. She is Moira and I think she reminded Bae of his childhood friend Morraine. Funny how in Hook, Peter tells Wendy that he will Kiss Moira. Not buttons or thimbles, but a kiss. True love’s kiss?

Yes, in Hook, Peter no only drops his phone out of a window once, but twice. That whole scene in NY with the Stranger just screamed Peter Pan. From the open window that Peter would also sit outside while listening to Wendy tell her brother stories, from the phone dropping, to the little white bird showing up,

[Phee]

@TheGoldenKey wrote:

As far as the “Wendy” connection, I still believe it will be Emma. I don’t think Bae, even as Peter Pan, would have gone back to the Enchanted Forest. That would rule out visiting Morraine. Peter always came to the real world, a world without magic. In the movie Hook, Moira (Peter’s wife) was Wendy’s grand daughter. Moria was the reason Peter left Neverland and stayed in the real world. In my mind, this has to be Emma. She is Moira and I think she reminded Bae of his childhood friend Morraine.

I think that Emma can be a Wendy connection of sorts, but there’ll still be someone else who was actually the Wendy. I agree that it’s quite possible that it was on the trip to our world where he met Emma that he decided to stay here, but I still reckon the traditional story happened at some point in our history before 1904 (the year when the story first went public as a play), otherwise our world wouldn’t have Peter Pan’s story at all.

They could twist it as though Peter came to our world multiple times over several hundred years, because he was inexplicably searching for someone. He met Wendy, and thought she was the one, so he took her back, but it turned out she wasn’t the one after all. Then one day, on another trip, he met Emma, and somehow sensed that they had a connection and she was the one he’d been sort of subconsciously searching for, and that’s why he stayed here, to be near her, because after whatever happened with Wendy, he realised that he wasn’t meant to take people back to Neverland with him, it was him who was meant to stay here.

[fairy dust]

@Phee wrote:

@fairy dust wrote:

Sorry for the confusion Nonnie…I don’t think Morraine is actually Wendy…just that she could be a nod to Wendy thus giving us a clue to Baelfire’s identity as Peter Pan. 🙂

Yes, I’ve wondered the same thing. That’s interesting that there’s a similarity between her name and Wendy’s. Love all the other little Pan connections you picked up too. You’ve become a master at finding the connections between the Mystery Man and these theories! 😉

Regarding the Wendy thing, assuming that Bae does end up being Pan, perhaps we could get a flashback ep for him at some point that shows him coming and going from our world, and finding his actual Wendy, (and also maybe her brothers), maybe she was someone who reminded him of Morraine. The Darling kids could exist at any point on the timeline from 300-odd years ago when Bae left FTL. (I’m ruling out a young Emma being the actual Wendy, because the real world timeline wouldn’t fit for the story to have made it to our world if she filled the role of Wendy.)

Thanks Phee 🙂 I agree about the flash backs and with young Emma not being a literal Wendy. The writers have so many options because of the flexible timeline.

I found this today and it really opens up a lot of possibilities.

Dr. Dan Kiley popularized the Peter Pan syndrome (puer aeternus) in his 1983 book, The Peter Pan Syndrome: Men Who Have Never Grown Up,[5] about individuals (usually male[6]) with underdeveloped maturity; his next book, The Wendy Dilemma (1984), advises women romantically involved with “Peter Pans” how to improve their relationships.[7] Patricia Craine’s book, Wendy’s Club: …for women hooked on “Peter Pans” and how to break the addiction (2006), addresses the same target audience as Kiley’s 1984 book.[8]

We could have an actual Wendy…or we could have a figurative “Wendy” who is hooked on “Peter Pan”…or we could have both…a Wendy from the past…and Emma as a figurative Wendy. If Baelfire is the Mystery Man/Neal Cassady/Peter Pan…who is the father of Henry, then Emma could be a figurative Wendy.

It will be interesting to see how close they stay to the original Peter Pan character…especially because the Mystery Man, if he is Baelfire, is very different from Snow White or Charming or Red as their primary identities are their Enchanted Forest/Fairy Tale characters while Baelfire’s primary identity is Baelfire. Peter Pan would be a secondary identity, something that happened to him after having lived in the Enchanted Forest with his dad. This really opens up a lot more flexibility as to how figurative they write his story…will we get a “real” Wendy…or a figurative Wendy???

I love the mystery man story line…there are so many layers.

[fairy dust]

(I’ve just modified this post into a new thread found here – https://oncepodcast.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1738&p=21974#p21974

I’m getting ready to go out of town…wish I more time as there is SO much more I’d like to post.

I’m going to throw something out there that I think is a possibility…it may or may not prove true…but if it does it could make for an incredibly layered, complex and interesting story.

I think that it is very possible that the Mystery Man/Neal Cassady, who we believe to be Baelfire and Peter Pan…could also be the Wizard of Oz.

We do not know how many worlds Baelfire passed through before he ended up in New York City with the identity of Neal Cassady. He could very well have passed through multiple worlds…thus having taken on multiple identities. We have a very long time period to work with that would be conducive to this. In one of my posts I mentioned some of the Wizard of Oz nods related to the Mystery Man…these may or may not lead to anything…they could be coincidence. But if they are accurate nods, I think they lead to the possibility of Baelfire going through multiple worlds…following the bean wherever it leads.

Here is what we already know…

Known – Primary identity – Baelfire

Possible – hinted identity – Jack and the Beanstalk because of the Magic Bean

Possible – Nods to the Wizard of Oz ( remember that in the movie the Wizard of Oz played multiple parts)

Confident – Peter Pan (very obvious connections to Neal Cassady and the clue trail left in the apartment)

Known – Neal Cassady (although we know this must be an assumed identity)

One of the clues in the Mystery Man scene leads to a place on the upper West Side called The Radio Foundation – who produced Fireside Theater (remember the fire at the City Hall that houses the theater). Fireside Theater (that ties in with the Beat Generation) was highly praised for their comedy albums…here is a quote from a review by Rolling Stone: http://www.benway.com/firesign/fst-reviews/wftelec.htm

The Firesign Theatre leans heavily on sound effects, using stereo to create a sense of space just like these old Sports Cars in Hi-Fi Stereo records, and using over dubbing and electronic effects to create a galaxy of character voices and background sounds. Layer upon layer of dialog and sound effects are present throughout most of the productions. One listen is hardly enough to begin to grasp what is going on, and six or seven tries later you’re still unearthing juicy tidbits. Their timing is dynamite, their dialog kaleidoscopic, and their satire is, so to speak, acidic.

I think this is going to be the Mystery Man’s story….layer upon layer, galaxy of character voices, Imagine the possibilities. I think we are going to go on an adventure with Baelfire that leads us to many places…and ultimately leads back to Emma and a little boy named Henry who needs a daddy as much as he needs his mom.

[midnight dreary]

I apologize if this has already been brought up, I haven’t read through the thread yet. I’m lazy. Sorry. 😆

But there was an unconfirmed OUAT Facebook spoiler released a few weeks ago that said that the show would explore Baelfire and Morraine’s relationship further. When I read that, I immediately started to think that Bae and Morraine were Peter Pan and Wendy. Why would the show want to explore Morraine’s relationship with Baelfire? They were only kids, so there probably isn’t much story to tell. But maybe after Bae was sent to another land, he used the magic bean to return to the Enchanted Forest and retrieve Morraine. Kind of like how Peter Pan jumped realms and took Wendy and her brothers to Neverland. Bae was probably lonely. 😥

[fairy dust]

@Midnight Dreary wrote:

I apologize if this has already been brought up, I haven’t read through the thread yet. I’m lazy. Sorry. 😆

But there was an unconfirmed OUAT Facebook spoiler released a few weeks ago that said that the show would explore Baelfire and Morraine’s relationship further. When I read that, I immediately started to think that Bae and Morraine were Peter Pan and Wendy. Why would the show want to explore Morraine’s relationship with Baelfire? They were only kids, so there probably isn’t much story to tell. But maybe after Bae was sent to another land, he used the magic bean to return to the Enchanted Forest and retrieve Morraine. Kind of like how Peter Pan jumped realms and took Wendy and her brothers to Neverland. Bae was probably lonely. 😥

Thanks for that info Midnight Dreary!

Perhaps we will get our Peter Pan/Wendy story before Baelfire is pulled into the green portal.

The resemblance between Morraine and Wendy (Rachel from 2003 movie) is uncanny. I don’t think that is accidental.

[attachment=0:1kpx5jlt]morraine and Wendy.jpg[/attachment:1kpx5jlt]

[TheGoldenKey]

Hi Midnight!

Lazy? I think not! LOL! You always make time to greet the newcomers and I like that about you! 🙂

Was this on OUAT’s main facebook page and do you remember where? I’d be interested in reading that. I’d love to see Morraine & Bae as Wendy & Peter. That would mean that Emma would be following somewhat in Moira’s shoes. So a bit of the original tale followed by a modern take of it via the movie Hook. Thanks for sharing Midnight 🙂

Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.

[TheGoldenKey]

@Phee wrote:

I think that Emma can be a Wendy connection of sorts, but there’ll still be someone else who was actually the Wendy. I agree that it’s quite possible that it was on the trip to our world where he met Emma that he decided to stay here, but I still reckon the traditional story happened at some point in our history before 1904 (the year when the story first went public as a play), otherwise our world wouldn’t have Peter Pan’s story at all.

They could twist it as though Peter came to our world multiple times over several hundred years, because he was inexplicably searching for someone. He met Wendy, and thought she was the one, so he took her back, but it turned out she wasn’t the one after all. Then one day, on another trip, he met Emma, and somehow sensed that they had a connection and she was the one he’d been sort of subconsciously searching for, and that’s why he stayed here, to be near her, because after whatever happened with Wendy, he realised that he wasn’t meant to take people back to Neverland with him, it was him who was meant to stay here.

Well Phee, you certainly make a good argument for this and now with Midnight Dreary posting about possibly seeing more of Morraine & Bae’s story, that makes a lot of sense.

Will be fun watching it all unravel in any event 🙂 The next few weeks will be very interesting 😀

Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.

[Slurpeez]

Henry bought the bell for Mary Margaret as a “so-glad-you-didn’t-kill-Mrs-Nolan” present. Yet, I still think the bell is a nod to Tinker Bell, whom we’re supposedly going to meet sometime soon-ish. 🙂

I’ve really come around to loving the Baelfire-is-Peter-Pan-thoery, which I remember Phee posted back before August was revealed to be Pinocchio. I’ve only just found this thread, but I’m loving all of the connections between Baelfire, the Mysterious Man, Peter Pan, and Neal Cassady! Fairy Dust, you continue to dazzle me with all of the layered meanings and possible interwoven connections. I swear you must have planted a bug in Adam and Eddy’s office.

Now that we can assuredly rule out Dr. Whale as a contender for the role of Peter Pan, I’m even more behind Baelfire being our Pan. Captain Hook followed a magic bean to Neverland, so why couldn’t Bae have done the same? I think the fact that Peter Pan is Edward Kitsis’ favorite fairytale is also very telling. I’m even more excited for Baelfire possibly being Henry’s dad, whom we’re first going to meet in Emma’s backstory in 2×6! 🙂

"That’s how you know you’ve really got a home. When you leave it, there’s this feeling that you can’t shake. You just miss it." Neal Cassidy

[TheGoldenKey]

@slurpeez108 wrote:

Henry bought the bell for Mary Margaret as a “so-glad-you-didn’t-kill-Mrs-Nolan” present. Yet, I still think the bell is a nod to Tinker Bell, whom we’re supposedly going to meet sometime soon-ish. 🙂

I’ve really come around to loving the Baelfire-is-Peter-Pan-thoery, which I remember Phee posted back before August was revealed to be Pinocchio. Now that we can assuredly rule out Dr. Whale as a contender for the role of Peter Pan, I’m even more behind Baelfire being our Pan. Captain Hook followed a magic bean to Neverland, so why couldn’t Bae have done the same? I think the fact that Peter Pan is Edward Kitsis’ favorite fairytale is also very telling. I’m even more excited for Baelfire possibly being Henry’s dad, whom we’re first going to meet in Emma’s backstory in 2×6! 🙂

As I’ve told Phee in another post, great minds sure do think alike 🙂 I know many of us were hoping August would turn out to be Bae/Peter Pan. TheWendyBird was another one, who, like Phee and myself, thought the same thing. My brain said Pino while my heart wanted Bae. When it ended up the former, I assured myself that while Bae would not be August, he most assuredly would be Peter. Hope my hopes aren’t crushed again. 😥 In any event, I just wanted to share my reasons for what led me to this conclusion in this thread.

Like you slurpeez, I’m rallying for Bae to be Henry. For me, the tone of expression, on Michael Raymond-James face, just mirrored a young Bae’s so completely. That intense sadness & seriousness. A look much too old for a child of 14 who is carrying the weight of the world on his shoulder. I saw that exact same look in MJR. Last night was a great kick-off to 3 very exciting episodes. It was all we could have asked for. Looking forward to next Sunday (Go Team Frankie!) and then we’re Tallahassee bound! Yeehaw! Keeping my fingers crossed that MRJ is Henry’s dad! (Let’s hope we don’t have to wait til season’s end to know Bae’s fate).

Keeper of Pandora's Box & The Yellow Brick Road.

[Author]

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