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I just watched the episode, my friends. And I’m still blown away. You’ve said lots of things I wanted to say already but I’ll share my thoughts after I gathered them and calmed down after THIS episode. *happy*
[adrotate group="5"]Are we sure that girl isn’t a CS fan or maybe we’re tell not just seeing things through our collective shipper spyglasses lol 😛
Yeah that’s how you declare a winner lol and by the way where was the team SwanFire poster I kept looking for it?
*happy*
Yep, pretty much sums up my entire day!
Are we sure that girl isn’t a CS fan or maybe we’re tell not just seeing things through our collective shipper spyglasses lol
I remember her saying in comments before that her OTP is Snowing – so far this season she has a soft spot for CS naturally BECAUSE THAT IS THE WRITERS AIM but she always appreciated SF too. 🙂 This is how I know we aren’t seeing things that aren’t there lol.
Someone needs to tell ABC, this is not how you promote a love triangle.
OMG
lololololol
Wasn’t there a shot of ALL THREE they could use? And they chose THE scene, where he tells her he wants to win her heart? Oh ABC. Your shipper bias is showing!!!
Keeper of Captain Swan's first kiss
Someone needs to tell ABC, this is not how you promote a love triangle.
LOL they really don’t do it the right way – well… they know what they are doing after all… 😉 Well, they released a Hook-poster with his “I’ll win your heart”-quote right before the episode. *clears throat* LOL
Sorry I rambled a lot (again!) – I’m a writer who should be writing anything but CS analysis right now but couldn’t help myself!
I’m not sure why I’m still remotely amazed at how one-sided the ABC people are being with it. It made sense to use CS stuff when Hook was all that Emma had in front of her but in an episode where all 3 were on screen multiple times, not to mention there had to be a picture of Hook and Neal fighting over the lighter, it seems very very odd that they used THE CS scene. LOVED their picture and quote mid-ep last night though. I agree though – this isn’t how you show a triangle which goes back to what we’ve been saying about it being past vs future and future is winning.
LOVED the wording of Hook’s speech. Sure it was confident (even though he has his moments of being worried like anyone in his position would be) but it was WHEN not IF. Interesting wording and I don’t think it’s just because he’s a “cocky pirate.” She didn’t shut him down on it though and was visibly affected by it.
This is Emma Swan. She’s bashed a guy’s head onto his steering wheel, threatens to punch people (so like her father!), she pushes guys away physically, she outright tells them when she isn’t in the mood for whatever emotional discussion they’re trying to have, and walks away. Hook *tests* her by moving in closely and she doesn’t budge! She is COMFORTABLE with him being that close. He moves in close and she can see his eyes. He’s always known about her lying thing. He has BEGGED her to look into his eyes to see if he’s lying (he’s not).
So is it so surprising that he moves in closely when he’s making very important statements that he NEEDS her to not only hear but to believe? To see the proof in his eyes? She was studying them throughout his speech (in and around looking at his lips) but she didn’t flinch or feel the need to back away.
She could very easily have seen how the conversation was going and said we don’t have time for this and kept moving. She stopped him to ask what the deal with Neal’s attitude was (she could have gone to him and asked him what was wrong but she didn’t) and after she got that answer, Hook got all serious and obviously talking more about their eventual relationship and she DID NOT BACK AWAY or shut it down.
Emma doesn’t like to be vulnerable. At all. Yet with Hook, all he had to say was how absolutely sure he was that she would accomplish her goal and she is compelled to ask if he really thinks that and goes immediately to her vulnerable state. She needs his reassurance. It gives her STRENGTH. What do we know is strength to Emma Swan? LOVE. Which she discovered in Queen of Hearts. It was the moment she realized that love wasn’t weakness it was strength, and every time she needs a moment of courage and strength, who does she look to when she’s surrounded by her parents and the man she loved and everyone else? HOOK – or rather, Killian.
I thought about the JMO quote as well with the flicker of hope and how she talked about Graham and Hook. Seems like that was ages ago but it was very interesting that we saw Emma shout for Hook while Neal shouted for Emma, and it was while she was watching Hook be attacked that she was able to summon her magic (which is based off emotions according to Rumple) and then she was able to light the candle.
Both guys were in danger, she barely risked a glance looking back at Neal before hunkering down in the thing and she knew what both guys were going through because she could see the shadow attacking Hook but he’s the only one she called out for. She put herself in a position where she could see him and Neal was off to the side. Even when they were released from the shadows, Hook dropped very close to Emma and Neal was way off on the side. Interesting blocking for sure.
Neal’s reaction to that moment – I really felt a switch there. We know how he feels about magic. It’s been one of those sticking points for us for as long as I can remember because he doesn’t like magic (even though he did begrudgingly use it recently to find Emma), and hearing Emma say that Regina (of all people) was teaching her how to use it, it’s like he shut off. He had this look of disappointment and disgust about it (understandably so from what he’s been through), whereas Hook was just accepting of it. Whatever means necessary and Emma just saved their lives.
We’ve said it a million times but I completely agree – Hook sees her for who she is and accepts all of her. Neal has the memories of a few months (not sure exactly how long but not too long) over a decade ago when neither really knew the other one. I stand by my theory that we’ve watched Emma learn she never really knew Neal, and now we’re going to watch Neal come to that conclusion about Emma. He said in Manhattan if he had known who she really was, he wouldn’t have gone anywhere near her and now he’s learning who she really is and as much as he loves her and always will love her, I don’t see him being able to be in love with someone who is literally made of magic. It’s a part of her.
Hook trusts her to use it for good. It’s who she is. She’s using it to save people. He has absolute faith in her and all of her abilities. Neal is distrustful because magic is magic and it’s burned him too many times in the past. Totally understandable. It’ll be interesting to see how that plays out, but it was an interesting switch how, after all that, he seemed totally fine with Emma saying she wouldn’t choose anyone but Henry, and then he saw Tink (more on that in a minute!) and then went back to what he said in Manhattan only less depressed-sounded saying that Henry was the one good thing that came out of them being together and if that’s all that’s there then that’s alright.
HUGE turn. I’m sure some see it as him respecting her wishes (and more power to him if that’s what it is, I was actually happy with him for it so I’ll take it) but I really felt like suddenly his heart wasn’t as in it as he thought it was. It’s more like where Emma is with him now, she loves him, probably always will, but a major issue for her (trust) won’t let her take it further than that. In his case, it’s magic. He hasn’t given up yet, and I’m anxious to see how he behaves in the future with everything else going on too. HOOK believes that neither man will give up fighting for Emma because he knows that Neal cares greatly for her too and that she is worth fighting for and not giving up on, but he doesn’t know NEAL anymore, and he hasn’t had a lot of time to get to know what their relationship was like. He only knows that Neal is the one that affected Emma so greatly that she now has these huge walls up that he is fighting every step of the way and slowly but surely, getting her to let him in and he’s doing it in a way that proves to her time and time again that she can trust him. He may vocalize things sometimes, but it’s his ACTIONS that speak more to her.
I was worried for him a bit when she said that the important thing to her was that he told her Neal was alive. For at least a split second I’m sure he was thinking that she had chosen Neal and he had been wrong, but he recovered nicely when she made a point about him not having to say anything and he did. She thanked him again and that gave him hope that she’s starting to see him for who he really is.
The pirate thing. Is it just me or was she trying to banter a little and it just took a wrong turn? She just made the off-hand comment that he is a pirate, but he took it so badly and looked so hurt by it. It reminded me of his dramatic body language when David complained about having to work with him during Emma’s speech in 3×01. Like after everything’s that happened, that’s still how you see me? Only now it’s intensified because he has proven so much to her and yet she still called him a pirate (which is a touchy subject for him, especially after spending time with David but that should have alleviated a bit now and then she said it so it brought it all back. Poor guy!)
Smiles. Man it was so good to see some smiles finally. All 3 smiled in this episode and it was refreshing. What’s interesting is WHEN and WHY they smiled though.
Emma hasn’t smiled since the kiss. Right after that she learned about Neal being back and the flood of emotions that caused, and Hook hasn’t had reason to smile either, and given Emma’s secret to Neal, while he was happy to hug her and finally be back with everyone and out of the cage, he didn’t have a lot to be happy about either. Not to mention on top of ALL of this, there’s still the issues with Pan and Henry.
So let’s break it down: Emma stops to have a moment with Hook and ask him what the heck’s going on with Neal (interesting how they had a mini-CS “fight” if you will in the same episode that Snow is fighting with Charming!). During that conversation, Emma gets her answers and instead of pushing Hook away or backing up or walking off when he gets serious about relationship stuff, she stays. She listens. She hears him out. She doesn’t say something like “I’m not a prize to be won” she says (in a breathy manner showing how affected by him she is) that it’s not a contest. (At this point I really don’t think it is but she hasn’t had time to process anything. She wants the guys to stop fighting over her but her priority is Henry – perfectly understandable).
To Hook it IS a contest because he truly believes she’s worth it and that both guys will want to fight for her and he’s letting her know that he will, but that when she chooses eventually (and she’ll have to – it’s a fact, not forcing anything RIGHT NOW), she’ll choose him because she wants to, not because of anything else and that’s how it should be. In fact, the whole reason he said she’ll have to choose eventually is because it was explaining the behavior going on saying “See – we’re both in this and that’s not going to stop. The fighting for you isn’t going to stop until you’ve made a choice (eventually) but right now the focus is Henry and once he’s safe and home, that’s where things will heat up with the rest.” It explained perfectly 2 things: 1) Neither guy is going to back off until she’s made the choice but it’s hers to make and 2) The priority is Henry and once that’s all settled, then she can focus on it.
THEN they went into her asking him for reassurance. He was so confident about everything and she didn’t question his confidence about any of it. She could have flirted back and said something about him being confident and so sure of himself (would have been nice to see her do that but under the circumstances she’s less flirty since the triangle is too much for her to deal with right now) but the moment he shows absolute BELIEF in her (in a season all about belief and an episode all about belief for core canon true love couples (Snowing and RumBelle), she immediately becomes vulnerable and seeks more reassurance. And in those moments, we get genuine smiles from both Emma and Hook. She sees that he’s sincere and he’s saying he’s never doubted her and knows with absolute certainty that she will succeed and his praise (once again) is making her genuinely happy which in turn, SEEING HER SMILE cracks that smile we haven’t seen from Killian in a long time. That REAL smile. He puts her happiness so far above his own it’s painful at times, but it was so nice to see a real smile from him that he saves for Emma these days!
Not to mention that she never shut him down, or backed away (if anything she leans closer, like always) and gave him so much hope, while Neal is running around grumbling that she doesn’t need Hook, or Neal’s sword cause she’s got Neal now (that was a very childish moment in a string of childish moments for both men – Hook is not excused from that).
Interesting staging too for when they’re all on screen because when they go to move together, Emma is right next to Hook and sticking close to him and Neal is always lagging behind or way out in front only to find that Emma and Hook DIDN’T follow him and he has to go back to get them. It felt like that was the case through most of the episode. The only time it felt remotely the other way around for me was when Neal and Emma were sitting on the log together and Emma suggested that she and Neal were on shadow duty and Hook invited himself (which Emma totally could have squashed if she wanted alone time with Neal which would have pained Hook in thinking that something else were going on, but would have understood and backed away had she done that, which she didn’t).
Side bar before finishing up the smiles thing: The childishness. Both men had moments of this but the lighter scene started off in a genuine way. Neal WAS having trouble lighting it and Emma was off to the side telling them to hurry and what’s taking so long. Hook asked for a chance to try it and was given that for all of 2 seconds. NEAL was very into combat mode and felt threatened (remember: he doesn’t know the details of Hook and Emma. He knows they “shared a kiss” and Hook called it a dalliance but he’s probably imaging all kinds of horrible situations for himself).
Hook tried for 2 seconds, Neal took the chance to show him up and say it’s not so easy huh (seriously – Hook just isn’t allowed to light stuff in NL, somebody is always shoving him out of the way). NEAL is the one that jumped back in and made it a fight and THEN Hook stooped to his level. Neal was also the one accusing Hook of trying to impress Emma right now which he reacted to with the “is that what you think I’m doing?” and then Emma yelled about how now is not the time for all of that (which it wasn’t). I think Hook would have gotten it if given more than 2 seconds but given the wind and the shadows and everything, it makes total sense that magic would win the day since anything else seemed to go out before it got anywhere near the candle. It was still ridiculous on both their parts.
Neal apologized for it and I was proud of him in that moment. I’m waiting to see how Emma and Hook’s next interactions go. She read them the riot act TOGETHER, but Hook tends to wait for quiet moments to talk to Emma one-on-one and doesn’t deal with a big audience unless he can help it. He did explain that it wasn’t over a stupid lighter, but I want to see them talk alone as that’s when he’s at his best and he knows when she needs to talk and knows when people need to shut up and listen and he let her say her peace and then move forward. Quiet moments are for after they’ve calmed down except in extreme cases (see Charming INSISTING on Snow talking to him because she hasn’t done so in over a day – was that being pushy? No. That was acknowledging that he did something wrong, gave her some time to cool off, but that the conversation HAS TO HAPPEN eventually and it was a great moment.)
One of the things I love about Charming and Hook is that they know the women in their lives really well and they know when to push and when to back off. We saw that with Charming when the curse broke, telling Snow not to rush things with Emma, not to push. He’s there for her when she needs him but he isn’t rushing anything (even though some of us really want more father/daughter moments!). He knows when SNOW needs to be pushed as well and he let her have a day to cool off before that happened. He was getting the silent treatment, all the while WANTING her to go home with everyone else and knowing that the closer they get to saving Henry, the less time he has with her and he still let her stay mad at him for a day before pushing the conversation.
Hook has shown time and time again that when he wants a serious conversation, he waits and has it one-on-one (the exception being the cave). He waited for people to leave in the diner to ask Emma the important questions. He waited for EMMA to pull him aside and talk about things (notice in this episode that Emma pulled Hook aside when it could have been a bonding moment with Neal and told Hook to go away or not come with them to begin with, and then on top of that followed his lead and looked to him through everything, and called HIS name when the shadow attacked both men, but then later on we see Neal pull Emma aside for them to have a chat, and by then she was just in a “what now?” kind of mood. She had all the patience in the world to let Hook invade her personal space and yes, deal with triangle stuff even though she doesn’t want to think about that right now, but also lift her up and show his unwavering belief in her. They were standing close and she leaned in to him.
But when Neal wants to talk, she’s so fed up with all of it that she doesn’t even look like she wants to hear anything he has to say. She’s said her peace, and one is giving her the space she obviously needs, and the other is pushing it a little to make sure he gets back in her good graces, but she does stay and listen and it was a really nice moment even though it started off with her look of now is not a good time for more of this garbage, didn’t you get the memo two seconds ago?
That moment: really really nice. He stayed back, gave her her space (she’s not comfortable being super close to him at the moment and he recognizes that – even though he likely also sees how close she stands to Hook, how she looks to him for everything, how she SCREAMED Hook’s name – full of panic, moreso than we’ve seen from her in a long time if ever and I swear her reaction to that moment was significant – and not Neal’s when they were attacked, etc etc, and all he wanted to tell her was that if Henry WAS the only good thing that came from their time together then they did alright. It acknowledged that Henry was her priority (something Hook already acknowledged earlier by saying that yes, the guys both want her and it’s gonna be an issue until she chooses but Henry comes first) and that it may have been the one good thing from their relationship (which is something that could very well be true (and I think is).
TINKERFIRE / Neal Smiles:
I find Neal to be like Bae in the moments where I find him very shippable with just about everybody but Emma. I haven’t even shipped EMMA this much. Bae: Morraine, Wendy; Neal: Regina (the idea of it anyway, no interaction really), Mulan (*sniff*), and now Tinkerbell. I find that when he interacts with women who aren’t Emma, I actually really really enjoy him. He seems more fun and lovable than he does when he’s around Emma. They had their cute moments over a decade ago but so much has changed and when I see them interacting, 95% of the time they’re just miserable for multiple reasons. But when Neal is interacting with anyone else, even with Mulan and explaining his Emma problems, there was just something there that lit up more for me.
TinkerFire was an interesting *idea* from the BTS cast picture where they were both crouched on the ground and she had her hand on his shoulder and Emma was holding a lantern above their heads. But I didn’t want to give into it because the idea of EvilFire was already sunk because of Robin (I’m totally on board with OutlawQueen though!). So I decided I probably wouldn’t ship Neal again until the Emma thing was dealt with and then somebody new would come into the picture.
So imagine my surprise when Tink doesn’t want to be helpful. When she thinks it’s all a stupid plan and she’s waiting for proof. And then BAM: Neal struts in with his magic coconut shadow cage and says hey Tink, long time no see with a smile on his face. Tink lights up! She recognizes him! (How remains to be seen because as far as we know, she last saw him as a 14 year old, but I think she might be the fairy who talked to August – without knowing it would hurt Bae in any way so she may have seen him older too, who knows – remains to be seen).
Neal actually SMILES and lights up that Tink remembers him. They spent a LOT of time focusing on Tink and Neal SMILING. It was a surprising reunion. Tink obviously didn’t know him with the name Neal when Snowing told her the plan. (We don’t know when he actually changed the name though so still no clarification on what age he was last but I strongly suspect that Bae at the very least had a huge crush on Tink even though I don’t think their timelines overlapped much in NL).
They were so focused on each other and smiling that Hook had to actually INTERRUPT the moment (seemed more like taking Tink out of a trance!) and remind her that they held up their end of the bargain in finding an escape plan so now it was time for her to do her part. (Remember she didn’t overly believe in this “plan” 2 seconds ago and all of a sudden she was happy to help. Anything for Baelfire!)
I know there were some interesting looks people have latched onto with Tink and Hook but the way he addressed her as Lady Bell and the fact that he was almost downright blushing (and that as far as we know – based on what Colin has said and Hook’s comments here and there, Hook was loyal to Milah’s memory until now. So anything that happened with Tink was at best, him trying to charm her into helping him with something. Hook flirts to get what he wants but I think that Tink may have pursued him heavily and said all kinds of things to make him blush but never got anywhere with him, which is evident by the fact that he didn’t give up his revenge for anyone but Emma).
So I think it likely that in NL, in the few years that might have overlapped for Tink with Hook and Bae: Tink was into Hook big time, Bae had a huge crush on her but was only 14 so had no chance, and Tink wound up alone with both of them gone and it added to her bitterness. Remember, she didn’t care so much about helping Hook (although him being there helped a bit since it was a familiar face and according to the actress a former alliance of hers but all the sudden Neal shows up and smiles and she’s totally on board?
It was very strange in that moment given his behavior about Emma all day long though. He was getting into petty fights with Hook which made it more like they were fighting for the sake of fighting over something and less about what they were fighting for, and then he was downright disappointed that she was embracing magic, she read them the riot act about them fighting over her and wanting to focus on Henry, he sees Tink and all of a sudden totally forgets Emma is standing RIGHT THERE which means either he:
- Was trying to make her jealous OR
- He really did forget temporarily and was just having a happy reunion with Tink
I’m inclined to believe the 2nd one because of how it was done. He wasn’t amping it up to make Emma jealous and we didn’t get any solitary Emma shots of her glaring or anything like that. It was let’s show how happy Tink and Bae are to be reunited with looks! I was almost expecting her to go hug him and have him lift her up and swing her around or something.
It was HOOK that pointed out they had a mission to do. Hook is invested in this just as much as Neal is because Henry is important to EMMA and on top of that, he’s basically said now that getting Henry back and going back to Storybrooke means that’s when he’ll get his chance and not until then. So while I don’t blame Neal AT ALL in that moment (it was totally human of him, just like Emma when she kissed Hook) it was very very interesting to me that in the midst of all of the things going on, including needing Tink to help them get to Henry, that they spent so much time focusing on how happy Tink was to see him and to see an actual genuine SMILE from Neal as well!
I really do find that I enjoy Neal in moments where it’s not about Emma at all. He can be sweet and charming when he wants to be (in a very different way from Hook but there’s nothing wrong with that – I have varied taste in men so I can appreciate both). It’s really just in his moments with Emma that I tend to want to smack him upside the head and tell him to get it together. So it was refreshing to see a genuine moment where he wasn’t thinking about anything and was just happy about something. Tink brings that out in him, like Hook has brought that out in Emma this season and I’m very much looking forward to learning more about their history and watching them interact more!
Not sure if she’ll just be a good friend for him or what. If she did know him as a 14 year old it’s obviously a little weird but again, I equate it to August being almost giddy when Ruby was hitting on him because now they were the same age and he likely had a little crush on her as a kid. I look forward to Neal at least having a good friend (and I think that Tink is friends with both him and Hook so might be able to help them get back to the days when they were friends maybe – she’s pretty intuitive about stuff too, not to mention stubborn!). And there’s always the potential for more.
My one issue with them is the fact that again, Neal hates magic and I’m not sure I could see him with a magical being. Right now Tink doesn’t have her wings but I kinda always figured she’d want to get them back someday and prove herself to Blue. That said, I think it would be very very interesting to watch her do what Nova apparently didn’t / didn’t get the chance to do, and actually CHOOSE to give up her wings for love. We know she’s a BIG fan of True Love and I could see Neal wanting someone who would actually give that up for him, especially since this entire mess started because Rumple couldn’t. (I fully expect him to repair his relationship with Rumple somewhere down the line, but it will likely be after Rumple’s “undoing” which I think will mean the end of the Dark One, and that’s still 300 years too late to undo the damage of all that time and the nightmares Neal suffered through – he’ll always love him though and I need that fixed!)
So I do find it very interesting / compelling and look forward to more of their interaction be it friendly or romantic. Since they killed MuFire off so fast, and then followed that with EvilFire by showing us OutlawQueen, I’ve been racking my brain trying to figure out who I do feel Neal interacts with well that makes me actually like it and they made a point of showing these smiles even with Emma right there and Neal was focused all on Tink (and then afterwards told Emma that maybe Henry was the only good thing – it was refreshing to go back to the beginning of the season mentality instead of the “must fight Hook” mentality regardless, because it puts things into perspective, but it also felt important because it came after Emma showing Henry was her priority yes, but also after he saw her do something that the perfect image of Emma in his head wouldn’t do: magic. I don’t think he’ll be over her and backing off right away, but he is starting to learn more about her and I could see this triangle being non-existent a lot sooner than I thought before this episode.
His reaction to her magic spoke volumes to me, and even though it was to save their lives, and looks like she’ll be doing magic again next week for something equally if not more important, he’s still not going to like that about her. I stand by him learning more about her like she’s been learning more about him. She’s had time to come to the realization that she wants to move on. He’s still hung up on the past but getting a big dose of reality.
If it wasn’t about any of that and he was just acknowledging that Henry is more important than still great, because it’s character growth (especially wording it that way since it’s something he’s held onto since Manhattan). It did seem like an interesting shift in tone for him, especially since at the beginning (when Hook and Neal were actually getting along albeit briefly, his reaction to what Hook was saying about his and Emma’s dalliance was to remind Hook that Henry is “our son” – it was very biting, all of his remarks were throughout the episode, which is why I said it sounded childish though TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE even though annoying watching grown men turn into 5 year olds, even if it was slightly amusing at times though badly timed).
It was a nice shift in tone (even if it wasn’t actually giving up on the idea) from sounding like Henry was an excuse for him to be with Emma, to making Henry be important again and that he might be the only good thing. I know I’m not wording this well at all because I do believe that Neal loves Henry and values him and he is the most important thing here to him. It’s just a different tone from the beginning of the episode when it was used more as a verbal dagger against Hook, and then it shifts to yes he’s our son and he’s important but he *could* be the only good thing that came out of them which is basically what Emma had been trying but failing to say. We know she felt that way in Manhattan for sure (and lied about it so he wouldn’t know about Henry at all), and then last episode she told him she wanted to move on and he stubbornly said he heard everything she said, didn’t blame her, he was never going to stop fighting for her. never. So it was a nice moment to hear him come back down from his emotionally charged outbursts (totally understandable), to being more realistic.
It was in those moments at the beginning of the season when I liked him the most – when he was actually accepting of the idea that he’d go back and try and hope that Emma would give him a second chance, but that 1) Henry is more important and 2) Emma may not give him another chance. He was realistic about it and accepting of it, and other than his stumble / knee-jerk reaction right outside of the caves, he was actually pretty good about everything she said at the beginning of the episode. We didn’t get much of it before Hook tried to mend his own relationship with Neal and failed miserably (*sniff*), but after they got the tantrums out of their system, he calmed way back down and came back to reality which was very nice to see!
I know people think Hook was pushy and I hate it. There’s a difference between acknowledging what’s going on around you and he wasn’t just saying “I will win” like she’s a prize to be won, and he wasn’t saying he was going to force her to choose him in any way shape or form. He acknowledged it would be HER CHOICE and that these stupid comments that she was asking what was going on about weren’t going to end until she actually MADE A CHOICE. That that element was always going to be there until a choice was made.
He WAS very confident about what her choice would be but it was still a CHOICE and he made sure to make it crystal clear that he was going to keep winning her over by doing things the right way (like he HAS BEEN) and that when she chose him it would be because she wants him and not for any other reason. She could have shut it all down RIGHT THEN by calling Neal back and then making it clear to both of them (since Neal was the one acting like a child in that moment, NOT HOOK), that her priority was Henry and if she didn’t want to even entertain the THOUGHT of choosing Hook, she could have shut HIM down right then too. But she didn’t.
It wasn’t until watching BOTH men act childish that she felt the need to shut it down. She was sad for Neal who was obviously hurt and therefore making multiple comments that sounded like he was about to cry and she obviously felt it was because of something Hook said (which it was but he explained why), and it wasn’t until later when it was literally getting in the way of the mission AND ALMOST COSTING THEM THEIR LIVES that she said the only one she chose is Henry.
She never said Hook was out of line in telling him. She was greatly annoyed because she made it clear to Neal that it was all about them and their issues and now Hook’s gone and made it seem like she was choosing him over Neal when it had nothing to do with Hook at all. That’s just an added layer that is hurtful to everyone. I really think Neal could have handled his past mistakes getting in the way. Once he calmed down he would have understood that. But now there’s another guy in the picture and it at least gives the temporary impression that the only reason he’d lose her is because of the other guy and that’s not the case.
I really really hate this “triangle” and I will be so happy when we can focus on just Killian and Emma and enjoy Neal being happy with someone else. I really do enjoy him when it’s not an Emma thing. It was GREAT to see him actually smile but it was Tink that made him smile like that, not Emma. Emma and Killian made each other smile.
Emma could stop the triangle at any time but she hasn’t which gives both hope. Killian is latching onto that hope and making sure he’s got a chance and she basically said that he did because she’s not with Neal and she’s obviously not making a choice right now. She has issues with both of them that need to be resolved and she’s got to process how she feels about something.
She trusts Hook. That much is evident through body language as well as words. She goes to him for strength, reassurance. She watches him closely when he says anything and she believes him. She trusts him implicitly and asks for his opinion when she could (and sometimes should) ask Neal. The staging of so many of the scenes in this episode made that clear for me. But she has to deal with a lot of things before we get to that point.
He also needs to give her sword-fighting lessons – she almost took his eye out trying to be helpful! Loved that she discovered that Neal thought the sword was in the cave though, and then outright told Neal that Hook gave it to her. Meaning he went back there and found it and kept it safe all this time because it meant something. And he made a point of saying he had given it to her because it was Neal’s and he wanted her to have something (isn’t he carrying Milah’s sword at this point? I need to rewatch the Crocodile but someone pointed out from the [spoiler]promo when Rumple takes Hook’s sword that it’s actually Milah’s and I recall there being some sword switcheroo from that so if so, that makes even more sense why he felt so strongly that Emma should have it.
It was a nice callback to the fact that Hook is sentimental as well. He always has been and WE know this but it was nice to see that as much as Neal thought he knew him, there was still something there that could surprise him, just like it surprised Emma. (Seriously that’s becoming one of their things – Snowing’s “did you ever doubt me?” is becoming CaptainSwan’s “does that surprise you?” – always with the look of hurt *sniff* Killian it will be alright!)
There are still a LOT of conversations that Emma needs to have with Neal and with Hook. I’m sure there’s also a lot of backstory that we still desperately need cause right now we’re going off the assumption that Bae & Hook parted on terrible terms (which they did) but somehow aren’t at odds right now EXCEPT over Emma. And on top of that, even with the Emma thing clearly bugging Neal and getting in the way, not once has he lashed out at Hook about Milah. It would be the PERFECT time to do so. In the cave when they were talking and he was asking Hook what he meant by all that, I completely expected him to say something like “what, first my mother, now my ex-girlfriend?” right when Emma walked in. I was completely and totally expecting that. It was nice to see that it didn’t happen that way, but that still needs to be addressed.
It was what bugged me about Neal’s reunion with Rumplestiltskin too (every single time). It was something that was SO important to him – it’s why he hated Hook (he thought he killed her) and why he wanted to leave Hook (he killed her just as much as Rumple did in his mind), and yet even when he’s angry at Rumple in Manhattan, he doesn’t once address it. It’s all about the nightmares and the letting go of his hand (perfectly reasonable) but even when they’re having nice bonding moments, there’s NO MENTION OF MILAH.
So it will be interesting to see how that comes into play. I feel like Emma has been putting two and two together. We saw her reaction to Hook talking about Neal’s sketches and how he gets it from his mother. She reads Hook pretty well and it was the same kind of reverence in his voice that he uses when he talks about Milah, but she didn’t push it. She also knows that Rumplestiltskin is the one who killed the woman he loved, but again – she has the clues I’m just not sure she’s putting it all together (and Rumple has killed a lot of people so it’s not out of character).
I really need her to talk to Hook and find out more. She was the only one in the cave that understood what a big deal it was for Hook when he said that he was letting go of Milah. The others don’t know that name. I think Snow understood on some level because she can’t even fathom losing Charming much less ever moving on so it was a big deal, but Emma knows who Milah is and how important she is to Hook. It reinforced every thought of what he’s given up to help her save her son and backs up all the trust she’s had in him this entire mission.
It will be VERY interesting to see the group back together next week. Rumple and Neal interacting after Neal paralyzed him in the jungle. Rumple AND Regina likely picking up on the triangle – Regina will feel vindicated since she was lashed out at for calling Hook Emma’s boyfriend and has no clue about the kiss, and Rumple – Rumple needs his son to love him again and doesn’t want him to be hurt so he could try and get in the way and the best way to do that would be to make sure Emma knows who she’s dealing with with Hook and put a wedge there, even though he’s the one that killed her. I think it might actually backfire on Rumple if he does it because 1) It’s admitting it in front of Neal and 2) Emma knows the depth of the love that was there and it makes perfect sense why he would do anything to avenge her death. If anything his loyalty is a commendable quality, even if it does make things slightly awkward with the whole Neal situation which leads to 3) Neal’s reaction to all of it: last we saw, he was upset with Rumple for having killed her but never got the chance to address it.
So if at some point Rumple does try to driving a wedge between Emma and Hook by telling her about Milah, he has some other issues too. It might really backfire because Neal could react and remind everyone that he’s the one who killed her and then…then there’s HOOK’s reaction: HOOK KNOWS that they were about to give Rumple the bean. The bean that would get him to Bae. That would have ended all this pain and suffering for everyone ages ago. The one that would have spared ALL of them a lot of torment. (This could look bad on Hook momentarily for keeping it, but if the entire truth is revealed, I think all of them will understand completely and it would ultimately look worse for Rumple, in at least Neal’s eyes. He already expects the worse out of him at every turn, but to actually KNOW that Rumple just had to let her go be with the man she loved and he could have gotten back to Bae but chose to kill her and make an enemy out of Hook instead, that would be extremely heartbreakinng but completely understanding too.
There’s so much stuff that needs to be resolved and out in the open before anybody will be satisfied with Emma’s choice. She needs to know about Hook/Milah, and the whole lost boys thing for Bae (I’m still hoping there’s more backstory that we get shortly of what happened to Bae once he left the ship), but they don’t seem to be holding any grudges. I think Neal probably realized a long time ago that he was wrong in that moment to say that Hook was as bad as Rumplestiltskin. I hope that the friendship they once had is repaired by them both admitting that they were stupid and headstrong in that moment. It doesn’t change anything, but I really think they’re not holding it against anyone. Neal can hold a grudge but he wasn’t that phased by Hook being around until he said he had something with Emma.
(Seriously that moment of pain in Hook’s voice when he was all “We shared a kiss.” *pause* expected more of a reaction to that. did she not mention it? let’s rephrase here. panic mode. “Our dalliance” – the way he said that word made it sound like “Wasn’t it important enough to warrant a mention? She really didn’t say anything??” My heart just broke for him in that moment because he sounded so lost and hurt!
So maybe the rhombus “joke” wasn’t realllly a joke? Cause I really feel like we’ve got Hook/Emma/Neal/Tink going on right now. In the promo Hook is on the left, then Tink, then Neal then Emma, Charming and Snow. Emma and Neal are facing away from each other, Neal and Tink are turned toward each other (much like Emma and Hook do) and Hook is off to the side. Makes sense to me as he’s all about the mission at the moment. He knows stooping to the childish level only upset her and almost cost them their lives, and he knows when she needs space, and on top of that he knows that in order to get her, they have to get Henry and get home first which makes it all the more important that they do so sooner or later. Perhaps he focuses better when she’s not right in front of him? – which will backfire because they always watch each other and not being by her side will likely make him panic) but I found the body language between Tink, Neal, and Emma in that shot very interesting, especially after the Tink/Neal interaction in this episode.
CHOMPING AT THE BIT for the next episode. I need to see the aftermath of everything that happened in this one. I need to see how people react, and what happens when the group is reunited! SO MUCH DRAMA that needs to happen and lots of conversations that either need to happen or be alluded to. I’d be fine in some cases if we just know that Emma know certain things and is fine with them. I really don’t think the Milah revelation is going to be a huge deal, but I’d still love to see Hook opening up to her and making sure she knows the history of him and Bae. It would be great to see them go off on a little mission or something sometime to be along the lines of “Hook told me” or SOMETHING. Nobody will accept her decision unless she knows him fully but they are opening up to each other and letting them in.
I still want Emma to tell Hook her history with Neal as well. He knows that somebody (likely Neal) did a number on her ages ago and that they share a son, and he also knows that she’s not running back to him like he was led to believe might happen which gives him hope. But I’d still love for him to learn what happened so that he fully understands why she reacted the way she did on the beanstalk.
The plus side to all of this? Ultimately I don’t think it matters. They’re things that will be thrown at them with the expectation of breaking them apart. No idea who will say what but given all the chances that various people have had so far, even trying to keep them apart in other ways, they haven’t been thrown out yet. Wouldn’t surprise me in the least if Pan goes to see Emma and tells her to ask Hook how he and Bae parted company all those years ago as another test to Hook to see if he’ll come clean with her about all of it. To make him admit that. It’s a villain’s job to get between them and the only couple he’s tried to get between where Emma is related, is Captain Swan.
But in the longrun, Emma will just be happy that he told her. That he opened up and let her in. She KNOWS the timing of everything that’s been going on basically since the moment they met? Hasn’t been good. (Love always comes at the most inconvenient and unexpected of times!) It was never really appropriate while Emma was in “mourning” (Hook’s view of the situation) to tell her by the way, the woman I just got over? Neal’s mom. And he might kinda hate me right now because I left him with Pan.
It’s VERY similar to Ariel and her mermaid secret. There have been a lot of parallels between Hook and Ariel recently but this one really sticks out for me. Ariel made a point of asking Snow to let her try to get Eric to fall in love with her before revealing the mermaid thing. It’s a very big part of her/her past, and is important for him to know, but you don’t go meet someone and tell them the worst things about you. That’s learned along the way but it usually starts off with at least a sliver of a chance at something good and real. We already watched Belle leave Rumple because he couldn’t open up to her and then bit by bit she’s gotten the important parts of the story as they’re relevant to now.
For Hook, all of that was in the past until Neal showed back up, and there hasn’t been a lot of time for him to talk to Neal about any of it, much less Emma. Again, he likes to have the serious heartfelt conversations one-on-one and it’s hard to get any of that time. As much as he’s got invested in winning her over, and trying to do it the right way, I’m sure that eventually she will learn all of this stuff and by then it won’t matter. It’s just another tragic part of the past and ultimately, while she needs to know about it, the people who need to actually address it/deal with it are Hook and Neal. (And given Neal’s attitude once he calmed down a bit, and the fact that he DIDN’T lash out at Hook about anything with the past, even after finding out he’s vying for Emma too, I have hope that they can be friends again someday. It won’t be the same as before and they’re roughly the same age now, but I think it’s actually possible at this point).
I’m more and more pleasantly surprised because I had huge concerns at the beginning of the season that Neal would be seduced by magic and follow in his father’s footsteps but so far it looks like it was just the one time and he’s against it enough to not go down that dark path. He wanted to break the cycle with Henry as well, agreeing with Emma that he doesn’t want to do to Henry what his dad did to him. Now that things have calmed down and refocused a bit, I think it’s more likely than ever that Neal is going back to when he and Emma were able to be friends/co-parents and got along fine even though one was with someone else, as well as what he told August about being able to move on if he knows she’s ok.
There’s so much history with CSF that needs to be hashed out but that takes time. I don’t think any of it will affect Emma’s choice at all though. She told Henry before that she wasn’t getting back together with his dad (though I fully expect a setup or secret mission at some point and I’m very curious what NEAL’s reaction to that would be by then – does he team with Henry to try and get her back or does he accept her choice and back her up on this? Is this before she’s made a choice? No idea but I know the kid is rooting for his dad obviously so I’m not sure. I’d really like everyone to respect her choice whatever it is though and I really want Hook to win over Henry too – and I think he will).
Can we just talk about the fact that Jared’s opinion has changed a little bit over time? Months ago he was saying that Emma HAS to end up with Henry’s dad (which caused a lot of people pain who thought it was more than an opinion or something when actors can think whatever they want but have to act as they’re told to onscreen), but now when asked about it, he says “gotta say I’m rooting for my dad but the Captain is pretty cool.” PROGRESS! It’s kinda like how Josh has come so far from “not with my daughter” to “I want her to be happy” – it’s a slight shift but an important one even if it just the opinion of actors! It’s more accepting of the idea that Emma will make a choice and that will be it (and I certainly hope so because the triangle is driving me bonkers and I can’t go through more hiatuses with the shipper drama after this season). Not sure if it’ll be over before the winter hiatus or not [spoiler]LOVE that Hook is close to Emma and Henry and Snowing in a lot of shots AND that we know they spend time together alone and we haven’t seen anything about Neal/Emma yet
Also from those pics Neal is back with the Darlings and everyone else (aww, DarlingFireFamily reunion!!!) and that when Neal IS close to Emma, it’s usually with Henry and Regina as well – I’m looking forward to the Neal/Belle interaction though too!
So I have hope that it *might* be finished sooner, especially with the way it’s continuing to be promoted (all season it was CS heavy but that made sense since Hook was her only option right then, now it’s still seems CS heavy). Not sure WHY they are doing that and as much as I love seeing it, I think it’s also very hurtful and ignores the fact that it is a shipper-made-triangle if nothing else (can’t believe they used THAT picture today for it. I expected to see the guys fighting over the lighter which would have been a bit more fair…) but the fact that they are doing that makes it look like they really want us to associate that with it. Otherwise they just used the picture from the scene where Hook said that he’d win her eventually because of that quote so that it related to the question they were asking, which was still hurtful to the other fans.
I celebrate the moments we get, even if it’s from the silly PR department that has no clue sometimes, but I do feel bad about it. I’m just happy that I’m enjoying Neal more and have reason to hope that CSF will be alright someday!
BELIEVE in CaptainSwan as much as Hook believes in Emma and we’ll all be ok. *deep breaths & cookies*
Keeper of Hook's Trenchcoat.
@MysteryKat – so glad you wrote all of that so I don’t have too!
Seriously. You said it all.
The only thing I will add is that I feel exactly the same way you do about Killian’s “Does that surprise you?” potentially becoming the CS catch phrase. I would love to see Killian continue to impress Emma with making honorable decisions and surprising her by showing her the man he is so that she can get over the “pirate thing” – then I would love to have Emma discover the truth about Milah being Neal’s mother and that Hook turned Bae over to Pan due to either something Pan does or something Neal does in an attempt to make her dislike Killian. But, at that point it will be too late – just like how Belle continues to learn horrible things that Rumple did in the PAST but because she loves him and has faith in the man he really is, she doesn’t allow it to affect the way she feels about him. So I would love for Killian to find out that Emma has learned the truth about who Milah is and his history with Neal and be convinced that means that she won’t choose him. But then when Emma tells him that it doesn’t matter because that was in the past and she is choosing him because she knows that he is a man of honor and good form and he looks confused she can say to him “Does that surprise you?”
Did anyone else’s CS shipper heart melt when Emma asked Killian if he thought she would really save Henry and he told her “I’ve yet to see you fail.” I thought his whole speech was sfdgfhjgjhgjyghgj!!!, but that part literally made my heart hurt in a good way . . .
Ummm . . . * politely raises hand*
May I ask everyone a question??
Am I the only one who is puzzled by CaptainFire??
I don’t understand what is going on? One minute Hook is mourning Bae on the JR with Emma and he is being nostalgic in a cave talking about his drawing ability and the time they spent together, and the text he and Neal are fighting like 5 year olds over a “lighter.”
I am . . . confused.
The last time we saw Hook and Bae, Hook was very fatherly toward him and I had the impression from the way that he spoke to Emma about him that his memories of Bae were “fatherly” as well. But nothing in their interactions together has at all made me feel that they ever had any kind of father/son relationship.
I love Killian but I am very confused by what the writers are doing. He didn’t even seem to care that they saved Neal. I totally get that he is in “competition” with Neal for Emma but it’s like they had him all emotionally affected about Neal until he actually showed back up – now it’s like there is no relationship there at all. For someone who is so confident about telling it like it is – I don’t understand why Killian hasn’t even acknowledged his relationship with Neal. Thanking him for not freaking out about the kiss has nothinh to do with THEIR relationship.
I’m assuming we are missing some major backstory that happened between them after he turned Bae over to Pan that will explain all the time Hook says he spent with Bae?? And that will explain why he is so nostalgic of him in his absence but seems to not give a hoot when he’s actually there?
Like I said. I am confused. I was really hoping to see the Hook/Bae interactions – completely separate from anything Emma and I am totally not understanding why it seems like this is being ignored. Am I alone here?
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