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Emilie’s comments about VisionBelle do make me curious. Still dunno that RealBelle will be doing anything consciously on her end, just because I can’t figure out how it’d happen. Like, unless she’s watching him 24/7 somehow, how does she even know when’s the right time to pop up for a chat? Unless she’s activated a magic mirror and is carrying it with her at all times?
Much as I want some RealBelle action, I actually really like the idea that VisionBelle is something Rumple’s creating on his own, because it shows how deeply he loves her that she’s still a part of him he can’t ignore, even though he keeps insisting he’s off on his suicide mission and that’s that.
[adrotate group="5"]Not maybe people can go against Robert Carlyle, a man known for his eccentric roles, and come out the creepier one in the exchange. That takes talent. He’s really menacing. If they had miscast the role, it could have been a disaster. How can a teen be menacing to Rumplestiltskin? But it really works.
WORD! They got the casting SO right with this one. Similar to Robert, Robbie’s got this character with layers to him, and you see multiple layers almost all at once, and quick changes in emotion. One moment he’s chatting away happily to Henry, then he goes dark to talk to Felix. And he can come across as friendly, but with that unmistakeable undertone of malice. The kid is BRILLIANT! I’m never gonna look at Peter Pan the same way after seeing this portrayal.
Yeah I’ve wondered before if they could explain it like that. As it turns out, Jared’s growth spurt hasn’t been hugely obvious to me, but Dylan Schmid’s on the other hand. 😆 I can get over it, because it’s just an unavoidable thing, but it does make me laugh that t-word wise, Bae was taller and had a deeper voice, then he shrank and went high pitched to fall through the portal. 😉
Ahhhh, Schmacky’s vid is amazing! That little smile he has at the campsite right after he says her name. *DYING OF FEELS* I can’t wait until after they’re reunited, and someone makes a vid to “Fix You”, because “liiiiights will guuuuiiiiiide you hooooommmmmme,” so that vid MUST happen.
Y’know I’ve often wondered how much they told Isham. If he knows general endgame or if he’s working episode to episode and only thinks he knows what is happening based on his background as a music writer. Apparently Daniel is going to be interviewing him at some point, maybe I’ll tuck this question into my back pocket for that.
Good question! I think Adam and Eddy probably brief him or at the very least give their opinions and final approval of the musical score episode by episode.
Doubt he’d know endgames, but he probably gets a memo to “drop a lil True Love Theme into the score for this scene,” whenever Kitswitz want it in there. Isham’s music is all so seriously beautiful. Makes me wanna weep.
JMo said it was a very human moment, but maybe that was just for Neal worrying about losing the love of his life to Hook of all people?
JMo’s comment is what’s keeping me from getting on board with the dream/hallucination theories. If she was talking about it being a “very human moment” for someone other than Emma, then JMo kickstarted the biggest fakeout in fandom history. Obviously, the SFer in me wouldn’t mind if it were true, because there’s gotta be some way to explain such a sudden and drastic change in Emma, mere hours after she was crying over how she never stopped loving Neal, so it being someone else’s hallucination would explain it away rather perfectly. I’d feel bad for the CSers though if it ends up being a vision of some sort, instead of it actually happening.
Also, because I’m totally suspicious of how promos are edited, I’m not even convinced that Charming’s, “Stay away from my daughter!” is actually directed at Hook. He’s probably yelling at a Lost Boy or Pan.
I think Liam’s gonna die, and Killian’s gonna take over command of the ship and go rogue, and then the Navy’s gonna come after him to get their ship back.
I’m confused though – Henry has the heart of the truest believer NOW, but if he becomes a full-on lost boy and loses his hope, how will he still have the heart of the truest believer? Seems like making him lose his hope and belief in his family would change that.
That has been confusing me too. If Henry loses faith in his family, then doesn’t that automatically make his heart weaker? But I think that as long as that loss of belief in his family is replaced with belief in his new NL family, the heart still stays strong, and now it believes in Pan as the icing on the belief cake.
In 3×4, Peter Pan said something akin to Henry now part of the family. What if Peter Pan really is Rumple’s brother, thereby making him Neal’s uncle and Henry’s great-uncle? That way, when PP says they’re family, they’re actual family. O_____O
Exactly. I’ve always thought that something the Brothers theory had going for it was that Pan needed a kid from his own bloodline. If his descent into madness began because he lost his mother when she gave birth to Rumple, and then his father ignored him and favoured the younger brother, the only way to truly satisfy his revenge and fill that void in his heart is by having that gap filled by someone else from their bloodline.
WOOT, I totally called that they’d be brothers because of the matchy names Killian and William! So that’s one set of predicted brothers down, and one to go. 😉
Also, if Charming is dying of dreamshade poisoning just like Killian’s brother, Liam, did, then that explains a lot of Hook’s emotional investment and recognition of the symptoms. Hook said that David only had days or weeks at most left, perhaps based on watching Liam die. That would explain why Hook said to David, “Doesn’t your family deserve to know you’re dying?” because he saw his own brother die the same horrible, slow death. Also, it would explain Hook’s line, “Why don’t you care?” since Killian probably loved his brother and cared very deeply about his sad fate.
Here’s my take on Liam’s (inevitable) death. Press release said they’re, “under orders of the King,” and if Liam is an honourable man, dedicated to his King, and his King sent him to the get cure for whatever, Liam’s gonna see that the cure gets back to the King.
So while in NL, they do find the cure, but Liam gets dreamshaded, and plays down the injury, (exactly like Charming is doing now). When it appears that he really is gonna die, Killian begs his brother to use the cure on himself, but Liam refuses, because risk of death is just part of the job when you’re a Captain in the King’s Navy. And BOOM that’s why Killian changed and became selfish, always looking out for #1, because being honourable and selfless is just gonna get you dead. And it’s also why he’s telling Charming that his family should know, because he went through the not knowing and the cure refusal in those final days with his brother as well.
Now, as for the cure, and if they found it before why is Hook telling Charming that there’s no cure now, I’m gonna say it’s something that’s either impossible to get to, or it was so rare back in the day that they got the last of the stuff and there’s none left.
Also, I think mermaids are gonna play into this somehow. Killian and Liam ran into some when they were there. Maybe after Liam died and was buried at sea, the mermaids came and dragged him down and taunted Killian or something? I’d say they drowned Liam, but I really want him to die by dreamshade instead. Maybe that other sailor that gets a credit will fall overboard and be taken by mermaids? Something mermaidy has to happen though, because Hook gets his hate of them from somewhere, and he had that hate the previous time we saw him in NL, so I wanna say that he discovered them on his FIRST trip to NL, back in the day. Also, it’d be a nice little lead in to the following ep, which is all about Ariel.
The only reason Hook would ever want to return to NL would be to live long enough to figure out how to enact his revenge on Rumple for killing Milha. That is what he said in “The Crocodile.” But if Killian had been to NL before, that would explain how he knew about time being frozen there and why he wanted to go there after the events of 2×4.
To add to this, I wonder if maybe NL wasn’t quite so dark back in the day? And it wasn’t impossible to leave. Without that knowledge, it would explain why he wanted to go back. So whatever Pan set up back in the day, he arranged for safe passage for Killian both in and out, and so Hook was expecting the same when he went back there to get the dreamshade to kill the Dark One.
Here’s Liam
Ah, I knew the name in the press release sounded familiar. Dude is an Aussie.
I think Hook sees a lot of himself in Bae–young boy abandoned by his papa and all alone in the world. But Hook had someone else. He had his brother, Liam. So Hook sees Bae not only as a step-son-ish sorta but also a chance to be someone’s Liam. He can do for Bae what Liam did for Hook.
This would be perfect and heartbreaking. Especially heartbreaking because he was trying to honour his brother’s memory, and he failed at it. 🙁
And as a RumBelle fan…wow, those Vision Belle moments…. was it just me or did Belle seem a little off there? Was it because she’s a product of Rumple’s own mind or is there more to her than meets the eye? A lot of RumBellers are upset that he dismissed her at the end, but I think the reason he did that is because he didn’t believe what she was saying about him, and he was ashamed that he was having second thoughts about saving Henry now that he knew his son lived.
I think she’s providing some good insight into his conflicting emotions. In 302 she was all, “You’re afraid you’ll make the selfish choice. You abandoned Bae, don’t do the same to Henry. Let go of the past.” And in 304 she was all, “Don’t forget the prophecy, you’ve gotta come back to me.” If she chops and changes in mood a bit, that just goes to show how completely confused and conflicted he is. But then she’s also always insisting that he CAN do the right thing, which shows that he’s still got that glimmer of hope buried inside, despite his confusion. It’ll be interesting to see if Belle’s words devolve and become a negative influence, the longer he’s in NL.
As for him sending her away, I don’t think it’s anything personal against Belle, he’s just having one of those moments where the back and forth arguing in your head gets too much and you’re all, “ENOUGH, JUST SHUT UP!” (I have these moments regularly, the constant back and forth of a Pisces brain can be freaking infuriating.)
We need an official 305 press release with the guest cast list STAT to resolve this issue. He does look kinda similar, but then, Rumple’s father is supposed to be in 308, not 305.
Original Peter Pan compared with ‘The Neck or Nix’
That’s some interesting stuff, quite a few similarities, right down to the need for a sacrifice and all.
What the Neck wants is a human spirit or love he wants to be loved and he wants to be human.In an old Danish poem he wants to be forgiven and to make Peace with God. He wants eternal life but thinks he must take it for himself instead of give it- through giving his ‘life’-childhood and grow old and die.. change is what he is afraid of.
I desperately want to get inside our Pan’s head and see if any of this stuff is lurking in there.
Peter Pan is playing THIS game against Emma: Peter vs. Emma. A master manipulator is by definition playing a game, but as he said, he wanted to see what he was up against, “The Savior”, and “I am not disappointed”. Yeah, he’s playing everyone, but it’s about Emma. I think that this has brought us back to how this entire show is about Emma. He is messing w/Henry, and telling him that he is the savior, he can save magic, etc.. We know that he’s been looking hundreds of years, for Henry, but is magic really dying? And he definitely wants to turn Henry against Emma, it’s all Emma, Emma, and now Neal/Bae is there….and it’s just another piece on the chess board we call Neverland.
At the moment I’m inclined to believe the “magic is dying” story, just because that seems to have been happening in FTL, with Blue running out of enchanted trees and magic beans and whatnot. It’s certainly possible though that part of that “saving magic” rests more on Emma’s shoulders than it does on Henry’s.
I’ve also been wondering though if his interest in Emma is purely from a “mummy issues” standpoint, and he wants to make her believe she belongs there with all the other lost kids, so she’ll stay and be their mother figure. He’s testing her maternal resolve right now, to see if she’s up to the task. So maybe he wants Emma as their mother, and Henry to save magic, and it’s like a two for the price of one deal that’s been set up as a long con over several centuries?
I know she hears the crying because she is an orphan, and we learn later how that connects to her being able to hear them. But, no one in camp heard her yelling to wake up, and Snow & Charming looked frozen. Then you hear a very low swoosh, and Peter Pan shows up.
Yes, it seemed odd to me that no one else got up when Emma did. Even if they couldn’t hear the crying, surely they could hear Emma? We’ve now seen a bunch of people knocked out with sleeping spells in NL, so perhaps he snuck in to take care of everyone else, so they wouldn’t interrupt his chat with Emma?
Actually, now that I’m thinking about it, that could answer the question of, “Shouldn’t Hook have heard the crying too because he’s supposed to have been abandoned.” If he was knocked out with a sleeping spell, then he wouldn’t hear.
In that same episode, when she runs up to him, thinking its Henry, they zoomed in on her face, like she was in some other zone. But I think that everyone hears what he is saying, but he speaks to to her directly, ie. she hears “between the lines”, the others do not. Later when she is gathering berries after the fight, the game is officially ON. He is putting ideas in her head by saying that Henry has not “forgiven” her, as she has not forgiven her parents. I think that she is the only one who can see and hear him. How far away could she be from camp?
He’s having SO much fun messing with her head. I wanna strangle and applaud him at the same time, because he’s so bad, but dang is he good at it.
Posting this here. But has anyone else noticed that every episode, Peter makes some sort of reference to game play? He talks about playing, the game, the “board.” He is very concerned with the idea of games and playing but these games are incredibly dangerous.
He’s still such a child, but at the same time he’s an evil genius. He’s a contradiction and trying to figure him out makes my head hurt.
