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@Marilou wrote:
Even if Regina was proven to be an unfit mother, Henry would not be put by default into Emma’s care. He would most likely be taken by the state and brought to Boston (They do have a bit of an unhealthy obsession with this city) where if she wanted to have a shot at being his mother she would have to apply to adopt him and being and ex-convict/single parent/rooming with another lady… I don’t think the great state of Maine would give her Henry… or any child for that matter. . By giving henry up for adoption she relinquished any and all legal rights she may have over his life. The fact that Henry went after her does not change anything.
That’s assuming that SB answers to the laws and government agencies beyond the town’s borders, which I don’t believe they do. I believe the legal goings on in SB are self contained, and as they don’t answer to any higher power, they can handle a situation like this however they see fit. In the land they come from, custody issues aren’t regulated the same way they are in our world. The situation in SB is that the adoptive mother is the Evil Queen, and the kid is a blood relation to Snow and Charming, so naturally, custody defaults to that family.
@Hellraiser-89 wrote:
As for the whole debate here about Regina being evil, which I have admittedly not read through that throughly, it’s funny how everyone’s quick to say she’s bad for Henry and she’s dangerous to him and so on. Because let’s face it, it wasn’t Regina’s fault that Henry died in the finale. It was Gold’s. He was the one who trapped Emma in the elevator and he was the one who prevented them from getting to Henry in time, all to get his magic back. Regina just benefited from that too, but she would never endanger Henry’s life to get magic.
I know there’s a lot of Dearies on this board, and I don’t hate Rumple or anything like that. He’s one of my favorites actually. But there’s also no doubt in my mind that he’s the most evil character on this show.Whenever Rumple does his evil thang, I’m in awe of the magnificent bastard. But I daresay most would agree that no matter how much you may love him, you’ve gotta admit he wasn’t a great father figure for Bae once he resorted to dark magic. Same deal with Regina, she’s fabulous when she does her thang too, and she’s not a good mother figure as a result. Neither of ’em should be entrusted with the welfare of a young child IMO.
I could see Regina dying, but not likely until the end of the show’s run. They’re not gonna alienate all the EvilRegals before the whole series is complete, that’d just be a stupid business move to piss off such a huge chunk of your audience. But it would be kind of poetic, that when the show began, we saw her sacrificing her father’s life to make all this happen, and then in the end, she somehow sacrifices herself to make it all right again.
@AntBee wrote:
However, Barrett being Peter Pan is my second favorite Barrett theory because Ethan Embry looks so much like what I picture an adult Peter Pan to look like. Also, if they don’t kill/banish Hook by next season, I could see Barrett clashing with Hook.
Was just posting in the promo thread before about how I’m thinking it’s Hook that gets hit by Barrett’s car, based on who we’ve seen out in the forest in snippets thus far. It’d be sorta perfect if Peter Pan’s first order of business as he came barreling into town was to smash into Hook.
Much as I love the idea that Nealfire was Peter Pan, the theory of Barrett being Peter has been growing on me too. I just hope that if he is, that Nealfire was still a Lost Boy.
Someone appears to fall off the roof of the car, and I’m guessing it’s gotta be Hook. He probably goes to shoot Rumple, Belle gets in the way, she falls down, then Barrett’s car comes speeding along, Rumple rolls Belle outta the way, and Hook gets rolled up and over the car. Then cue the end credits.
@TheGoldenKey wrote:
Are we really going to try to compare this adoption to a real life situation? Seriously, we are talking about the Evil Queen adopting Snow White’s grandson. Somehow, I don’t think real life adoption rules and regulations come into play here. It’s a fantasy show and not meant to be taken so seriously. Because it’s fantasy, real world rules just don’t apply. You simply can’t compare real life adoption or fostering situations to this at all. We’ve got the Evil Queen, who murdered Snow’s father, murdered her own father, tried and thought she successfully murdered her mother, murdered countless others throughout the years, murdered Graham, nearly murdered Henry, and we’ve got people rallying for her saying how dare Emma assume she’s got no parental rights? Seriously? 😆
Are we really willing to forget mommy dearest’s baking activities that landed her adoptive son in the hospital, at death’s door? I think any rights were long done after that shinning moment of motherhood.
Emma tried to give her the benefit of the doubt. Emma reached out on Henry’s behalf. Emma saw the vision of her chocking the life out of yet another victim and said enough was enough! Ever think that perhaps Emma instinctively knew that what she was seeing was her own vision due to her own magic thus the vision could be trusted? Emma, Snow, Charming, and the others, don’t have the benefit of seeing what the viewers do.
I want to see Reggie redeemed. Lana continues to floor me with the depths of her performances. We go from feeling so sorry for her as Reggie, to hating her as EQ, back to feeling so heartbroken for her as Reggie.
In the end, it’s all make believe. I can’t put any weight into whether they are following appropriate adoption laws when I see the Queen of Hearts, standing by an invisible ship, alongside Captain Hook and turning a man into a fish. Fantasy.
WORD to all of that. The fact that they had Regina and Gold speak of the adoption as “a deal” and that he “procured” Henry for her, makes it all sound underhanded, which is to be expected IMO. I mean, if it was all legal in real world terms, then why was the local pawn broker involved in the process at all? He was only involved because Regina knew him as a baby dealer in FTL, so she went to him in SB for that same purpose, likely because she had no real world legal avenues to go down to adopt a baby.
Regarding the apple turnover debate, IMO the main point isn’t whether or not Regina is to blame for what happened to Henry in particular. The point is that she was willing to put ANYONE under a sleeping curse, let alone someone she knew her son cared about. Even if it had gone as planned, and it had knocked Emma out, that’s still just as bad as what ended up happening…either way, Henry got hurt. Even if she’d put a stranger under a sleeping curse, that’s still a very bad thing to do. So either way, Regina’s not a decent, stable sort of a person who should be in charge of the welfare of a child.
On a lighter note, Charming’s “Its impressive that we can still provide her with a few traumatic childhood memories at this stage of the game,” made me 😆
@EvilQueen wrote:
Initial reactions to the episode and to every scene – Emma is really not consistent (and believe me, this is the nicest word I can say about her right now). How could she remotely believe Gold?
Because whilst his actions may be dubious, his knowledge of magic is undeniable, and they needed an immediate solution to a serious problem. The last time Emma went to Rumple, he didn’t claim to have power over who she was and what she could do, in fact, he told her the complete opposite when she accused him of it. So she knows that it they pit wills against each other, she has the ability to keep her own mind and make her own judgements if she deems his input worthy of consideration.
Now there’s absolutely NOTHING that will help Regina, nothing can be unsaid and obviously she’ll come back to the dark side.
It’s true that nothing can be unsaid, but eventually, somehow, Cora will be exposed, and Archie will be found alive, and it’ll be clear that Regina didn’t in fact murder anyone. Then everyone who believed she was guilty will feel like crap, which sucks for them, but makes for some juicy angst and struggles between characters’ relationships, and I’m all for that because it’ll keep things interesting.
And what was Snow thinking, of course Evil Queen would be trying to kill her the minute she had a chance, it’s been her motif for all those years, why would she suddenly forget it?
And it’s always been Snow’s thing to believe in good, so she had to give Regina one final chance before giving up on her completely.
@Marilou wrote:
BTW, How does Emma dare tell Regina that henry is not her son? Emma gave him up when he was a child, I was all for Emma having contact with her son again and when the truth started to unfold, I did not mind henry being raised by the charming… Emma went too far this time around. Regina is henry’s mother no matter how hard she tries.
Emma crossed a line she shouldn’t have when she said that, but given the circumstances, I can’t really fault her for saying it. In that moment, she believed that Regina had just killed Archie and that her innocent act had been a really good act, good enough to fool Emma’s infamous lie detecting power. Emma believed Regina to be very dangerous in that moment, too dangerous for Henry to be around. If I were Emma, I probably would have blurted out the thing that would have hurt Regina the most in that moment too.
I loved all the back and forth between Emma and Regina in this ep. Thought it laid out really well just how complicated their relationship is. SwanQueen shippers must have been losing their minds on that little emotional rollercoaster.
@EvilQueen wrote:
@NONNIE wrote:
I am going to have to watch it again but I think the curse included everyone in FTL not just Snow and PC.
No, they say that with the protection spell Regina cannot do anything to Snow or Charming, that’s it. Only later on Snow added that she will kill Regina is she tries to hurt anyone in her kingdom – which confirms that the Evil Queen can harm others and the spell protects only the Charmings exclusively.
They’d just demonstrated that they had access to powers that could defy Regina, so they probably figured it was safe to assume that she wouldn’t do anything that would give them cause to come after her. And they may well have been correct, and perhaps Regina didn’t go around harming people between the day they set her free, and the wedding day, when she dropped her little bombshell, in which case, their plan worked to keep everyone safe. There was no way they could have anticipated her getting her hands on a curse to send them all to another world, because as per usual, Rumple was the man behind the scenes, manipulating everything to set it up just how he wanted it. He knew that Snow’s weakness was to want to believe in the good in Regina, so he exploited that and used Snow to get Regina set free. He worded everything perfectly to Snow, so that she said the right things to Regina, so that Regina would believe what she needed to so that when she heard about a curse to send them all to a different land, she would instantly jump at the chance. Once again, I’m in awe of that devious bugger, Rumple. He is the man.
@TheGoldenKey wrote:
@EvilQueen wrote:
Another thing – did Cora save Pongo on purpose? Could she have imagined he would be used to help frame Regina? Does she know Rumple so well that she knows his methods? For example, instead of paralyzing the dog, she could’ve let him keep on barking so that the people around would be more alarmed and surely some witness would’ve noticed Regina/Cora leaving?
Letting Pongo bark would only draw attention and risk being captured. She didn’t want to get caught. If the plan was for everyone to think Reggie had done it so that Reggie would break then getting caught would have ruined that. The gig would have been up when there were two Reggies. She wanted the clean getaway with Reggie being hauled in after the fact.
Not only would Pongo drawing attention have risked Cora being captured, which would have defeated the purpose of Regina being accused, but Cora didn’t want any interruptions, because then she wouldn’t have been able to get away with Archie. Her plan wasn’t just to frame Regina for murder, it was also to snag Archie, to pump him for intel.
@myril wrote:
The dreamcatcher – very interesting. There was a dreamcatcher in Neal’s apartment, probably the one he once “found” together with Emma. So, now let’s go for some happy speculations! 😛
It’s certainly no coincidence that we saw another dreamcatcher, and that this time it was being used for a magical purpose. Rumple may have used this opportunity to test out Emma’s powers, because he’s planning to use her to track down Bae, and maybe he’d been planning to get her to do this with Bae as well, as a means of proving his identity. If Neal is Bae, then that dreamcatcher theme would tie together quite nicely.
That execution scene, hmmmm. It didn’t hit me that much in the sneak peek, but seriously, excuting someone with shooting arrows at them is a very ineffective, unreliable and even cruel way.
It’s effective from a dramatic standpoint though. Gotta love the imagery of Blue freezing the arrows and having them fall to the ground at the last moment. 😉
Regina had the best lines in this episode
to Archie: Doctor? Doctor. Need I remind you, you got your doctor from a curse.
to Red: Private conversation. Go take yourself for a walk!
Also liked how she called him a bug and had a line about him chirping in people’s ears. It’s interesting to see how the two personalities of the characters blend, but it’s a bit of extra fun when their alternate persona is an animal. 😆
Ah yes. the presence of YoungSnow pretty much confirms that this ep will be about what happened to her mother. Can’t wait to find out!
@RCz wrote:
@medchen wrote:
Good question. Perhabs he did go to Neverland as one of the lost boys… I’m trying to make him not be Peter Pan you see, because I still don’t want Peter Pan to be a grown man 🙂
I don’t want him to be Peter Pan either, because that would mean that there is a Wendy out there too. 😡
They’d have to do some serious tweaking of things if they were gonna have Wendy be middle aged on the show, like an adult Peter Pan could possibly be. The story of Peter Pan and Wendy happened in Neverland past, some time before 1904 in our world, because that’s when their story was first told here. In the story, Wendy returns to our world in the end. She’d be over 100 if she were still alive. Unless they tweak the story and the timelines to prevent her aging somehow. I’d think it more likely that we may get a relative of Wendy’s, like her granddaughter, as opposed to Wendy herself.
@Carolanne wrote:
Who’s running from whom again? I’m not clear on this everyone, sorry.
If Neal is the one running away, then maybe it’s because he recognised his father and simply bolted because of shock and not knowing what else to do. He just needed some time to himself to think.I believe it’s Neal who is running, with Emma chasing him. Pretty sure there was a spoiler somewhere that the chase ends in an alleyway, when Emma catches him and throws him to the ground, (can’t remember exactly where I read that, but I’m sure I did somewhere).
