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It could always be both. A spell and a potion as part of some kind of ritual. I don’t think something as powerful as a resurrection would be as simple as mixing an eye of newt with a bat wing and calling it a day so yeah, i’d say maybe he does both in some kind of elaborate dark ritual. It’d be easy for someone like Henry who has basically no first hand experience with magic, to mess up such a powerful ritual.
Thanks Watcher 🙂
That gives me an idea actually. What if the potion is to get to the Netherworld but the spell has to be done in the Netherworld to get back? So it’s kind of a two part ritual, only Henry doesn’t realise that and only has the first part so he becomes stuck in the Netherworld. Regina, Emma and some others would then have to go and rescue him.
[adrotate group="5"]All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixWatcher, I wonder a lot about how Neal would act to this or that in the story. Under the spell of shattered sight I think all his pent up feelings for his dad would come out. I can’t imagine him really saying anything to Emma but his ire would be focused on his father. But we shall never know because they ruined the show by catering to the Mouse and a demographic of fangirls.
It would’ve been really interesting to see Neal under the shattered sight spell. I agree with DSB that Neal didn’t hold much back from Rumple, so I don’t think Rumple would’ve caught the worst of it mainly because the shattered sight spell brought out people’s concealed feeling and Neal didn’t conceal his feelings towards Rumple except we never saw Neal confront Rumple about Milah so that might’ve been the thing he brought up. I think Neal might’ve said some things to Emma but not go for the jugular type stuff probably along the lines of petty things like Snowing had with each other when they were under the spell. I think the hook stuff would’ve been very interesting because there is so much there that Neal could go off on: taking Milah away, using Bae to find out how to kill Rumple, selling Bae out to Pan, whatever went on in Neverland, knowing Tamara was up to no good and not saying anything about it (considering Hook once wanted to be “family” with Bae, he should’ve told Neal about Tamara), Pursuing Emma throughout Neverland when Henry should’ve been the priority, etc. A perfect opportunity that was wasted.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixI need some help with a fic I’m writing please.
So Henry is planning to bring Neal back to life but it goes wrong and Henry ends up in the Netherworld because he accidentally split his soul from his body.
The problem I’m having is Henry’s method of doing so. It’s a choice between a spell or a potion.
A spell is more unpredictable so it would be easier for Henry to make a mistake, to expect one thing to happen but instead something else happens, however, all the spells we have seen on the show have been big and widespread whereas Henry is doing this in secret and the type of spell he’s doing isn’t a “small” thing.
A potion would be more easily concealable, and though Henry could still make a mistake, the problem is that since Henry is drinking the potion, he would expect to rip his soul from his body to go to the netherworld and the mistake becomes that he missed out putting in the way back. Henry seems like the type that would research excessively if he was going to do something like that (though there would be a considerable lack of information on the Netherworld) so would he seriously ignore the risks and go ahead with it?
Any thoughts would be very helpful 🙂
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixUrsula+Cruella=💗#RelationshipGoals
🐙🐶 pic.twitter.com/7zJtfGMCxz— Merrin Dungey (@RealMerrinD) January 13, 2015
All about that Cape bout that Cape… @OnceABC #BehindTheScenes #throwback #capeseries4 pic.twitter.com/1rjgicCJjz
— Christie Laing (@ChristieLaing) January 13, 2015
From katmtan http://katmtan.tumblr.com/post/108059207707/correction-after-analyzing-carefully-i-have
CORRECTION: After analyzing carefully, I have confirmed that the cabin is the EXACT SAME cabin as Mr. Gold’s cabin, with some modifications (seeing as they added that red fence in front of the house)
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixGuess who is on set today? pic.twitter.com/7uUiUbRzXS
— Helga Ungurait (@heglahegla) January 11, 2015
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of Felix
The show really wasted the opportunity to show Rumple and Henry forming a bond. As it currently stands, Henry was only pretending to want to spend time with Rumple and specifically invoked Neal’s name to get Rumple to agree so that he could spy for Regina, whilst Rumple only likes Henry because he is Neal’s son rather than liking Henry himself. Of the 3 scenes we had of Rumple and Henry together (including the deleted one)in the entire first half of season 4, only one of those scenes showed any resemblance of a slight (and that’s probably being generous since Rumple had worked out what Henry was really up to) bond between Rumple and Henry and that was when Henry was asking to learn magic and Rumple gave him the furniture polish to use. Even the one scene of Henry with Belle, which was clearly their first real scene together since Henry didn’t know Belle preferred not to be called “Grandma”, wasn’t used for bonding or relationship purposes but to basically have Henry screw up RumBelle by knocking stuff off the shelf so that Belle could discover the magical gauntlet. Henry’s relationship with his paternal grandparents is extremely neglected on the show.
Throughout season 3 and 4, it seems like A&E have forgotten that Henry was more or less the heart of the show. Without him, none of the other characters would probably be even talking to each other, he is what binds them all together. At the moment, however he is nothing but a walking talking plot device. Whilst Jared’s acting isn’t necessarily at the same high level standard of Lana Parilla, Robert Carlyle, Emilie De Ravin, Jennifer Morrison, etc who all have more experience than him, when he is given something meaty to actually do such as the Panry stuff, he pulls it off brilliantly. Half of the problem at the moment with Henry is that he isn’t given anything meaningful to do. He’s just there with the odd line thrown in to remind the audience he actually exists.
The writing of Once has gone downhill especially since the 11/11 split came in. The main issue is, instead of doing one story arc split over the two halves, the writers are taking a season’s worth of material and shoving it into half a season at which point it’s never spoken about again aside from perhaps the odd line thrown in. Characters are left underdeveloped, questions are left unanswered, and the emotionality impact is benched in favour of Action! Plot! New Villains! The Frozen arc got away with it only for the fact that those characters followed the movies so closely which is so recent that Elsa, Anna and Kristoff didn’t need to be fleshed out at all because the audience could just refer to the movie for their background. Ingrid was the only one that needed to be fleshed out but because she had the benefit of being in an urn for a few decades, her backstory was more or less able to be told in one episode.
Ships have taken over the show and not in a good way. Whilst you are likely to get a lot of “ship scenes” in the sense that, since all the regular characters have paired up with each other, anytime those particular two characters share a scene- be it Snow and Charming, Belle and Rumple or Emma and Hook, it’s a “ship scene”, you can’t ignore all other sorts of relationships on the show in favour of a particular ship. For example, the Emma/Henry and Regina/Henry relationship, which were both so prevalent in season 1 to the point that it was a mother/son TLK which broke the curse, have been ignored in favour of the CS and OQ ships. Fans will ship who they want to ship, regardless of whether it’s canon or not (hence the number of crack ships) but you can’t force a ship which it feels like the writers are trying to do with the newer CS and OQ whilst the older established ships like Snowing and RumBelle are forced into the background in order to give OQ and CS more screen time.
Snowing and RumBelle work because, even though you got the TLK in their first respective episodes, we were still shown their getting to know each other periods and their emotional connection, actually liking and caring about each other and chemistry. For Snowing, this was Snow Falls and the rest of season 1. For RumBelle, who differ from Snowing in that they are still a work in progress who haven’t achieved their happy ending yet, this was Skin Deep and Lacey. Both Snowing and RumBelle had a period of time where they didn’t even like each other before starting to form a friendship. This where CS and OQ fall short.
Chemistry is important to a ship but shouldn’t be the basis of a ship. Two characters can have chemistry but not be shipped together by everyone. For example, Rumple and Cora had crackling chemistry where he’s teaching her to spin straw into gold, Zelena and Rumple had chemistry of the I don’t want to like it but I kind of do sort in Witch Hunt and Bleeding through. I don’t ship them but there’s chemistry there.
For me to actively ship a ship, the ingredients have to be:
Chemistry between the characters
A period of getting to know each other (this could start with a not liking each other but it doesn’t have to)
An emotional connection
Friendship/Caring about the other
Something moreCS have chemistry, climbing the beanstalk showcases this. They don’t particularly like each other after Tallahassee, so far so good, however, CS skips the vital stages of getting to know each other and an emotional connection. There is no friendship formed, it immediately jumps into something more territory. I get Hook fancying Emma but there’s a difference between fancying someone and suddenly having an undying “love” for them. I get Hook going to Neverland to help in the context that, in the aftermath of Neal’s “death” in season 2, he feels guilty about what transpired in Neverland with Bae, so he wants to help Bae’s son because it was his fault that Henry ended up in Neverland with GOAT (though once again a non-romantic relationship, CaptainFire, is neglected in favour of a ship and more specifically a love triangle which would’ve benefitted from having CaptainFire established). What I don’t get though is why Hook suddenly feels able to move on from Milah, whom he’s been on a revenge quest against Rumple for at least a century, for a woman who so far hasn’t given him the time of day and doesn’t want to know. Why does Emma all of a sudden care for Hook romatically when she has repeatedly rejected his advances even up to near the end of 3B?
With OQ, the writers haven’t even bothered to try and set anything up between them, instead opting for an extremely crap “because pixie dust said so” in an effort to fast track OQ to beloved ship status……and it hasn’t worked! Even ignoring the dubious moral implications of Robin willingly dating his wife’s murderer and Regina making Robin to not be an honourable man, there’s been no getting to know each other, no emotional connection, no friendship/caring about the other, it’s just jumped straight into “something more” status. Regina’s Evil Queen reputation should’ve at least made Robin wary of her, setting up the perfect opportunity of getting to know each other, instead the writers have just had Robin jump into the “you’re hot” stage and continued it from there, in the process absolutely destroying Robin as a character in order to push forward with a ship. Even Regina’s character is being dragged down by the OQ ship.
In regards to Henry and the writing, I don’t think the writers know how to write Henry anymore. In season 1, he was the cute plucky kid who made rash and impulsive decisions. That worked for season 1 Henry but as Jared grew older and started outgrowing the cuteness, that’s when the problems started. Season 2 Henry was a brat who flipped flopped between which parent he liked best. Whilst a younger Henry might have gotten away with it, season 2 Henry was unlikeable because the writers tried to write him like season 1 Henry. 3A Henry was an improvement over season 2 Henry but they made him gullible to the point that he looked like an idiot. Jared had grown up to the point where Henry looked like he should’ve known better. Had they shown him following Pan all along it would’ve perhaps been more believable, but they showed Henry doubting Pan at certain points (which made sense) then immediately showed Henry believing Pan and giving up his heart after a talk with Wendy. Again this comes down to the 11/11 split, had they spread the story out over both halves, they could’ve shown Pan actually having to work to regain Henry’s trust, or if they’d shown previously Henry having his judgement clouded by a pretty face that could’ve worked too, but they did none of that. 3B and 4A is where Henry started to be omitted from episodes which is also the same time CS and OQ started stepping up a gear before going full blown canon. Henry is older and wiser now, a far cry from season 1 Henry. He can have meatier storylines, actually serve a purpose within the story as it is, so why are they neglecting him in favour of pushing ships that aren’t even as good as the two they established in season 1?
Why not focus on the family drama instead of the romantic drama? They lost viewers when they killed off Neal. Whatever the reasons were behind that particular decision, why did they not explore the ramifications of that major event? They could’ve still had Rumple go off the rails, they could’ve had Emma affected but trying not to show it, they could’ve had Henry acting out much to Regina’s concern. They could’ve still included the Ingrid plot and shattered sight spell without the Frozen aspect in season 4, making the situation even worse. They could’ve had this brilliant FAMILY DRAMA involving ALL the regulars in important roles since the 3 people who would be most affected (Rumple, Emma, Henry) had close connections with the rest of the regulars (Belle, Snowing, Regina respectively). Instead they passed all that up in favour of pushing two ships which means, unless you are a fan of those ships, you’re kind of screwed from a storytelling perspective.
I also wish they’d have the regulars interact with the recurring characters rather than just the guest stars of that particular set of 11 episodes. Granny, the dwarves, Geppetto, Archie, Red, Whale etc add to the small town feel of Storybrooke. Now they’re just glorified extras. 4A felt like Storybrooke was solely populated by the regulars and the Frozen cast until the Shattered sight spell rolled round then the town came alive only to go back to being populated by the regulars once the spell was over.
Sorry for the long rant.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixKnow how I said not so long ago how, if Emma is going to end the show with a love interest, it’s going to be either someone she’s romantically involved with currently or someone she has been romantically involved with? Then I ruled out Graham and Walsh because of their actors being involved in other project? Turns out Covert Affairs is ending which stars Chris Gorham (Walsh).
Know how I said that if CS were meant to be end game they were having a suspiciously easy time of it onscreen when the other couples eg RumBelle and Snowing there happy times happen offscreen a lot. With the newest article with A&E saying that CS would have a couple of “happy” episodes it got me thinking. What if Walsh is the one to come back?
I know it is a completely crack theory at this stage and probably won’t happen (though Walsh being a flying monkey was a crack theory too) but it’s not impossible.
1. Walsh was Emma’s first “real” relationship after Neal to the point that she was considering marrying him.
2. Walsh’s story was kind of left hanging. We presumed he died because of the poof of smoke but “no body, no death”
3. Henry actually liked Walsh and Walsh admitted that he actually did care about Emma.
4. Chris Gorham is about to be more available.
5. It’s unclear how much freewill Walsh actually had after he was monkeyfied in Oz.
6. There would be plenty of drama in an Emma/Walsh relationship because of the New York/Monkey thing.
In regards to the smooth sailing for CS, seriously it’s suspicious. If we look at RumBelle, Snowing and even OutlawQueen, it’s been too easy for CS, and A&E saying what they did in the last article, it feels too soon to have Emma be settled with her endgame.
RumBelle
Happily reunited in 122/201- Rumple nearly screwed it up by setting the wraith on Regina.
Happy together during 202/203- Offscreen
The Crocodile- Belle having issues about Rumple’s lack of honesty but agrees to a date when Rumple is honest with her at the end of the episode.
Having the hamburger date in 208- Get interrupted because Regina wants Rumple’s help.
Having a picnic date in 210- Get interrupted because the Charmings decide to accuse Rumple of murder. Presuming the date continued afterwards once the Charmings had left-Offscreen.
RumBelle back as a couple in 211 as Rumple is about to set off to find Bae- Belle gets shot over the town line and loses her memories.
212- Rumple tries to get Belle’s memories back but Belle’s having none of it and breaks the chipped cup.
216- Rumple phones Belle for what he believes is his last phone call.
Lacey- Amnesiac Belle is more accepting to let Rumple help, Regina turns her into Lacey
Lacey and Rumple drinking together in 220- -Offscreen except the 2 second shot of them stumbling out the Rabbit Hole.
221- Lacey accepts Rumple then inadvertently gives him the idea to kill Henry.
222- Belle gets her memories back. Rumple has to go save Henry in Neverland, leaves Belle behind and thinks he’s going to die.
RumBelle separated until 310
RumBelle reunite in 310- Pan’s in town and is planning nefarious things.
311- Rumple dies.
RumBelle separated by Rumple’s forced enslavement to Zelena until 320- Rumple proposes but is planning to kill Zelena despite Belle asking him not to and gives Belle fake dagger.
321- RumBelle engagement but Rumple lying to Belle and covering up his part in Zelena’s death.
322- RumBelle wedding but Rumple still lying.
401- RumBelle Honeymoon but Rumple still lying and concealing the real dagger then finds the magic hat.
401-411 is basically a mixture of Rumple lies and offscreen happy moments.
411- Belle finds out the truth and banishes RUmple from Storybrooke.Snowing
The past 3.5 seasons in a nutshell:
Together but constantly separated through various outside forces so that they have to constantly find one another. Have a baby, have to send her away because of the dark curse.
Become cursed with Snow as a lonely schoolteacher and Charming as an amnesiac coma patient until he gets his “memories” back.
Embark on an affair that goes wrong.
Split up.
Get their memories back and reunite.
Get separated by different worlds and struggle to find a way back.
Get back and reunite.
Accuse Regina of murder.
Accuse Rumple of murder.
Believe Regina is a murderer.
Have to deal with Regina and Cora.
Snow murders Cora and gets a dark spot on her heart in a plot that went nowhere.
Poke Emma about being jealous of Neal and Tamara.
Plan to go back to EF.
Grow magic beans.
Have magic beans stolen.
Have to go to Neverland to save Henry.
Charming gets poisoned by dreamshade in a plot that goes nowhere.
Snow wants another baby.
Do nothing major to help save Henry.
Plan to move to Neverland.
Realise they don’t have to move to Neverland after all.
Sail home.
Poke Emma about being with Neal.
Have to deal with Pan in Storybrooke.
Go back to the EF.
Snow gets pregnant.
Casts curse to go back to Storybrooke then pulls a plot device so Charming can live.
Lose any intelligence they once had and don’t suspect the random stranger they have completely welcomed into their lives.
Have to literally be told said stranger is the villain.
Fight flying monkeys.
Have baby.
Have baby stolen.
Get baby back.
Name baby after the guy who had to die so that they could literally be told that stranger is a villain.
In 4A, basically poke Emma about dating Hook, get overly possessive of the baby, make Emma be afraid of herself, ignore Henry, tell Regina to totally go after the married guy, ignore Belle unless they need her help and generally don’t do much to help.OutlawQueen
3B- Going well then Marian returns.
4A-Complicated but ongoing. Includes sex in crypt.
411- Robin chooses Regina. Regina has to send him over the town line potentially forever to save Marian.Something has to come along in 4B to rock the CS ship.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixWith regard to Neal’s “fighting for” line, I think that’s open to interpretation. A lot seem to take it as he’ll never stop fighting for HER, as in, to “win” her, but I think there’s an alternate interpretation whereby he’ll never stop fighting FOR her, as in, being on her side. I think that second interpretation is more true to Neal as he was (I especially think of that conversation in the woods in 315,) where what he wanted was her happiness. He’d never stop fighting for her, as in, he’d never stop fighting on her behalf.
One of these days I’m gonna figure out gifsets and parallel those 314/315 conversations, I swear I am…
That is a nice interpretation and actually one I hadn’t thought of. Now that you say it, it would be totally within Neal’s character to do that, to look out for Emma because he still loves her even if she doesn’t love him back like she used to.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of Felix
