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Count me in as someone who can empathize with Milah. I wouldn’t have made the choices she did but I understand her and feel that fandom has generally been unfair to her and way too forgiving of Rumple.
Aww, welcome to our small & select club Sweetgrass 😉
Rumple killed Milah and maimed Hook because he wanted to, because he wanted to punish Milah for leaving him and Hook because Milah loved Hook and not him. Rumple crushed Milah’s heart after she told Hook she loved him. He acted in a jealous rage. It wasn’t to get the bean. Milah offered Rumple the bean in exchange for an amicable separation. If Rumple cared more about getting to Bae than punishing Milah, he would have said they had a deal and been done with it. Instead, Rumple acted like he had a deal so that he could get close to the bean but never actually said he did. Just like he never agreed not to hurt Zelena with Belle when he proposed. For me Rumple was always intent on punishing them. He probably was planning on killing Hook but Milah told him the truth and he couldn’t handle it.
THIS! Exactly! This is the exact point that Rumple defenders over look or gloss/skip over in their defense of him & flaming of Milah & Hook.
The rest of your post also deserves Rum & hooky cookies 😉
The only thing Milah did that was wrong was leaving Bae, but even then she left him with a loving parent, whereas Rumple basically abandoned Bae to an unknown world. What he did was worse. I actually don’t find Rumple’s childhood as an excuse for any of his actions. Malcolm left Rumple with two kindly women who cared about Rumple before Malcolm became twisted Pan.
Agreed.
I can understand how Rumple’s childhood could affect his decision making process as an adult, but lets be honest, adults cant keep blaming everyone but themselves, for their poor life choices.
Yes Rumple’s father was a grade A douche bag, but 1) He left Rumple in the care of some LOVING spinsters, 2) Said spinsters did all they could to give Rumple a “happy,” “loving” home & childhood 3) Rumple chose to go back to those same spinsters AFTER his father abandoned him & be raised by them 4) Said spinsters gave Rumple the ability to better his prospects & have a good future.
So it’s not like Rumple’s childhood was “horrible”, nor does it seem like Rumple Never had any “good” examples to learn from or follow.
There comes a time where as an adult, one has to either “choose” to take responsibility over ones own life, or “choose” to live as a victim, blame everyone else for ones problems, therefore sucking the life out of those around you- since they are expected to make things ‘ok’ for one- right up until eventually everyone is driven away or leaves (which to be honest is EXACTLY what Rumple did- I dont blame either Milah or Bae for ditching someone whom chose to be such a septic & toxic person).It’s funny how people over look Rumple being ‘brave’ enough to want to & be proud to go into battle, to protect his family, his kingdom & to Remove the stigma, he himself STILL carried from his own fathers shady dealings, so it’s not like Rumple didnt know FULL WELL what he was doing by injuring himself- he knew FULL well he would be condemning his family by going through with it, yet he chose to do so anyway.
So yes, while I agree that Rumple as an adult, with a family to support, shouldnt be using his father abandoning him as an excuse or a pass for his treatment of Milah’s & his son’s needs, prospects & desires, I do think it is understandable- in his mind- why he injured himself- not that I condone what he did in anyway shape or form, but I do ‘get’ why he chose to do it- he didnt want to Bae to grow up father-less (& that is the one thing Rumple wanted- his father)- Of course, that doesnt take context into consideration- Rumple’s not having a father, due to said father being a manipulative, lair whom chose eternal youth over his son, as opposed to Rumple possibly dying in battle, fighting to keep his kingdom & son ‘safe’ from ogres, it’s not like Rumple would have been abandoning Bae for his own selfish desires & leaving Bae feeling as if he wasnt worthy of being loved by his father- dying a hero in battle is hardly ‘abandoning or emotionally abusing’ your child & if anything it would have maintained his families standing with-in the community & ensured Bae a better standard of living.@surayya, Did A&E say that about Rumple refusing Milah’s requests for a fresh start elsewhere before or after 308? Rumple probably did refuse Milah’s requests to move else where without saying why, which was probably frustrating to Milah, but he had his reasons.
They point blank laid it out for everyone in one of the specials (A&E outright stated on screen that Milah had asked (or begged) many times to move & what we saw in crocodile was her last attemptto convince him, which he shot down & thats when she decided to leave, as she knew this was her chance to escape the life he had forced her into… I doubt she would have ever agreed to marry & bear the children of the village coward).
I have all the specials stored on my external HD, so will hunt them out & track down exactly what they said, but I’ve already paraphrased (as couldnt remember if my wording was ‘exactly’ as they laid it out, in order to be direct quoting) what they said on the matter.I know he had his reasons- but she didnt know that (at least A&E never said she did know his back story- probably because A&E didnt actually know the exact details of his back story until 3A LOL :p ) & it’s hardly her fault Rumple refused to move & give their family a chance to flourish again, just as it is hardly Rumples fault for thinking Milah was being abducted against her will- he didnt tell her why he wouldnt move & start over for the sake of their family, she didnt tell him she was leaving if he wouldnt allow them ALL to move on & start afresh.
Both were selfish in their own ways, as both took the ‘easiest’ option out for themselves- Milah however did NOT choose to murder Rumple out of spite, yet he choose to murder her out of it.
It is also one of those situations that is no win for the character, Milah was damned if she did, damned if she didnt- just like many other characters have been- no matter which choice a character makes in those situations, they’ll inevitably tick of a decent section of the fandom as a result 😉It would be interesting to see more flashbacks of the Rumple/Milah marriage and also flashbacks of Milah/Hook. We’ve not really seen much of Milah beyond the two episodes she’s in and the audience were predispositioned not to like her because the first time we saw her, she wasn’t being kind to crippleRumple who the audience already had sympathy with because of what we saw in season 1.
It would be interesting to see those flash backs, yes- I seriously doubt we’ll get any though 🙁 , which is a shame, as it could be a great way to ‘grow’ at least 2 of our main characters directly & ALL the other mains indirectly, through their connections with either Emma or Belle.
I guess thats where I’m different & maybe thats where those of us that can understand Milah’s actions (even if none of us would ‘chose’ to do ditch a child while doing so), differ from those that cant- I’m not a great Rumple fan & tbh I never have been (not sure if the others are the same or not)- I dont hate Rumple at all, I can just take or leave him- although he does tend to drive me INSANE, making the same mistakes repeatedly lol. So I’m not emotionally attached to Rumple in such away that way that I cant see the wood for the trees in this situation 😉
Maybe that’s why I dont like Rumple more- to much risk of the character doing something I just cant fundamentally accept as being acceptable & be comfortable sweeping under the rug. Ie. I accept Charming & Snowing etc. Killing in battle to protect themselves & their kingdom etc. I cant accept Rumple & Regina’s murder of innocent people- just to further their own means- although Regina hasnt killed anyone recently, so she has grown on me considerably & now ranks as one of my top 5 characters (girlfriend better not make me regret this new found fondness in S4 lol :p ).[adrotate group="5"]Of course Milah was angry with him, but there’s a difference between being angry with someone and telling them that you wish they’d died in the ogre wars in a moment of spitefulness.
Now see I actually equate that with Emma’s “I wish it had been a joke & you were really dead” line to Neal- lets be honest if you are hurting & blurt out the truth of a matter- 9 times out of 10- it doesnt come out the way you normally would say it if you could think about it 1st (ie. it tends to come from a very emotional place- not a rational one).
In Emma’s situation, she didnt want to hurt Neal, but she had to tell him the truth- so she did it as ‘lightly’ as possible. In Milah’s situation, she wanted to lash out at Rumple (I guess to make him feel some of the pain he was causing her) the only way she could- with words, because intended or not- he had deeply hurt her by destroying her (If Henry’s intentions end up hurting his loved ones- I WILL SCREAM! lol).I do wonder whether Rumple told Milah about his father abandoning him. His reluctance of “a fresh start” makes sense when you realise that “a fresh start” was what prompted Malcolm and Rumple to go to Neverland where Malcolm abandoned him. It also makes sense why Rumple crippled himself so Bae wouldn’t grow up without a father. If Milah didn’t know, it would explain why she found it frustrating that Rumple wouldn’t start over when he gave no reason as to why he wouldn’t do it.
Rumple didn’t murder Milah just because she left him, it’s not that black and white, there’s a whole lot of other things behind her murder. He shouldn’t have done it, just saying that there is more to it than she left him.
I doubt he did tell her, otherwise her leaving makes no sense in the context A&E have laid out for us.
I totally agree with your 2nd point- pretty much nothing on the show is black & white 😉Rumple and Regina are complicated characters.
lololol Think we could all agree that that is almost an understatement when it comes to those 2 lol :p 😉
I very much agree with the above! I also feel like I’m one of a very small minority that can sympathize with Milah…she wasn’t awful to Rumpel until he wounded himself in order to return from the wars, thus making himself (and therefore Milah by extension) a village pariah because of his cowardice (although personally I can see how his actions required courage in a way as well, but that’s a whole different discussion). His actions made her life miserable, so of course she was angry with him.
And something I think people seem to forget is that the night before Milah left, she asked Rumpel to move somewhere else, where they could start over without his reputation dragging them down. Since he couldn’t even do that for her, she left him for the life she wanted. And then ten years later, he murdered her for it. I wouldn’t necessarily equate that with “rape culture”, but I can see the argument there–he felt that as his wife, he basically owned her and she had no right to make her own decisions. I see it more as murdering her simply because she hurt him, but either way, I think murdering Milah was one of the worst things we’ve seen him do. I mean, he murdered his son’s mother! Yes she had left, but who knows what might have happened if she’d tried to establish a relationship with her son when he was older.
I also take issue with the whole “she’s-evil-because-she-left-her-son” thing. I know I’m looking at it as a modern person and all, but the idea that a woman’s worth is only as great as her ability to have and nurture children really bugs me. I think I’ve said it before on this thread, but would it have been any better for Bae to grow up with a mother who hated and resented his father, and as a result went out drinking every night? I think Milah knew that as much as she’d grown to loathe Rumpel, he still genuinely loved his son and would take good care of him. It wasn’t like Cora leaving Zelena in the middle of the woods—she knew Bae would be taken care of and apparently regretted having had to leave him behind.
So yeah…I don’t necessarily identify with Milah myself (luckily for me!), but I certainly do feel bad for her. Of course, I really like Rumpel as a character too—I just kind of have to forget that he murdered his first wife/mother of his son for having hurt and insulted him, just like I enjoy Regina’s story and have to sort of block out the fact that she once ordered the massacre of an entire village to get on her side.
Whew, long post—now to catch up on the more fun stuff!
Another great post- Rum & cookies for you too 🙂 (Glad I’m not the only one who actually listened to A&E when they explained Milah’s actions & her situation- seemed like I was for a while there lol 😉 )
I pointedly sidestepped the very serious, in and of itself, *rape culture* accusations mostly because they had absolutely nothing to do with the rabid hate of Hook (which is where it was mostly used). It was self-righteously spewed to try and denigrate a character (and by association, his fans) because the accusers levying the disgusting claims, were too immature and shallow to admit that their *favorite surfer dude*, Neal, was not, now, and never would be Emma’s lover, let alone her true love. Simple, really.
Desperate denial apparently knows no decent boundaries. The very fact that they were using those repulsive accusations was proof of their own abuse, disrespect and disregard of a serious problem. It is why I have no respect or time for any fans (Neal’s or otherwise) who walk that particularly scummy path and talk that particular repugnant talk.
Rumple and Regina WERE and ARE guilty of much more pointedly *culturized* crimes in that regard and in general. And frankly neither one of those characters has had an easy path to redeeming themselves, as it should be. All the characters seeking some kind of redemption have rightly struggled, including Hook. Viewers can agree or not as to whether those characters’ level of suffering/redemption suits their personal standards, but to throw around disgusting *rape culture* blame and outrageous labels is more a sign of their own ignorance, mean spirit and pettiness than it does give any validation to what they are ranting about.
Milah freely chose to leave her husband and child. Her husband brutally killed her for it, maimed her lover and also abandoned the same child to a hell hole time portal just to keep his ill gotten power. Truly he is a criminal, evil bas*ard, but is constantly given a green light for *true love* with Belle. Go figure.
Regina is guilty of many murders and brutally killed Graham basically for the same reason Rumple murdered Milah. She didn’t want anyone else to have him but her. She was a despicable, emotionally abusive lover to Graham. She too is given a pass so she can find true love with the tattooed thief! Massive problem? Nahhh.
But Hook? He spent 300 years mourning, grieving, plying himself with rum, painfully angry and seeking pointed revenge for the murder of the one woman he loved, then is demonized and accused of every filthy dirty motivation, action and grossly false misogynistic accusation because…? Emma CHOSE not to want anything to do with Neal, the man who basically (oops) fathered a child with her when she was a teenager, taught her how to be a better thief, broke her heart, was a lukewarm lame-ass and never came looking for her after she had spent time in jail, ignored her for ten years, went on with his life and new love relationships and died because of selfish designs to bring his father(whom he abhorred) back from the dead for his own personal gains. You know, Saint True Love Neal.
Right.
Pfffft.
And I didn’t want Neal to die.
Wish I’d read this page 1st now lol- EXACTLY!!!!! Thank you! Gold star for Bo 😀
Here have a shot Rum & some hooky cookies 🙂I think the reason behind Rumple’s wrath towards Milah and Hook was more about Bae than it was about him. He was hurt and angry because she left her son for another man – a pirate- which leds him to become a person who seeks for power and controlled by his hunger for power, he became his worst fear his father who also left his son because of his selfish needs. Eventually Rumple made the same mistake which haunts him for forever. The guilt was unbearable and he knows Milah was also responsible from Bae’s lost. And the wrath and hate he held for her became more and more powerful each day not only because Milah was responsible too but blaming her made it easier to endure the anger and hate he felt towards himself. And Milah who has no love or responsibility towards her son deserves that much hate and anger
I agree & disagree with you here, I think most of the reason Rumple killed Milah was Rumples own self loathing & quilt over HIS actions in letting Bae go, at the same time as breaking a promise to his son- in the biggest way possible- Rumple’s letting go of Bea had nothing to do with Milah- that is on Rumple IMO.
Then another part of Rumple killing Milah IMO, was How dare she be “Happy” & in love/have it all with someone else, when Rumple has a crusty life & now nothing- not even Bae anymore- Rumple’s Dark One persona took over & he not only murdered her, he maimed Killian as well, just cause he could/wanted to- I see plenty of people bash Hook for shooting Belle, so IMO, they should also be bashing Rumple for maiming Killian (at the very least), if not murdering his ex-wife, or even turning a dude into a bug & squashing/killing him because Bae got knocked into :/ Some fans seem to be very hypocritical when it comes to what is “ok” for Rumple to do.she also chose to be a complete bitch to Rumple during their marriage. Milah was never the victimised woman. She wasn’t dominated or forced to do things she didn’t want to do by the men in her life.
I actually have to disagree strongly with a few of your statements as they go directly against CANNON fact- it is cannon fact (direct from A&E mouths to the ears of their world wide viewers), that Rumple REFUSED ALL of Milah’s pleas to leave the village/life he had forced them all into with his actions, for a fresh start somewhere else. Rumple adamantly refused her requests time & time again, When we saw Milah ask Rumple again in Crocodile, for them to leave & start afresh again- it was her last attempt at trying to ‘stay’ with him/ keep their family together- I will NEVER accuse her of doing the wrong thing by leaving Rumple like she did- it was a frankly sad, lonely, loveless marriage for her to be stuck in & she has every right as anyone else to live a “happy” life herself. Sure she wasnt ‘abused’ (that we know of), but that doesnt mean her marriage was good or that Rumple was a ‘good’ husband & labeling Milah a “complete bitch” towards Rumple over one action is more than harsh IMO- as that means by your definition, EVERY character on Once is a complete or total b!%@h or B@s$%&d period :/
This doesnt mean I approve of her leaving her young son- because I dont, esp without so much as a good bye or I love you- but I also take into consideration that A&E flat out stated she ‘didnt take Bae with her, as she didnt feel a pirate ship was a ‘safe’ place to raise a child & despite Rumple being a poor/bad (cant remember which exact word they used there) husband, Milah KNEW Rumple was an excellent/loving Father, so she knew Bae would be safe left in his care’.
People need to realise the distinction between being a Bad husband & Bad father- the 2 do not necessarily go hand in hand- Rumple was a BAD husband- that is cannon FACT (whether Rumple fans want to hear it or not), however he was a GOOD father (at that stage, which no one can deny). Rumple put Bae’s needs above his own (as a good father should)- However Rumple put Milah’s needs below his own wants & desires, & that is NOT a sign of a good husband, nor of a healthy or happy marriage :/ I dont understand why people dont get that concept 🙁
One of my fav moments from the movie 🙂
WOW! Congrats RGF!!!!! Bragg away! 😀
Loving all the pics guys- that last kiss, wow, just gets me everytime 🙂
