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I actually empathize with Neal’s fans. I know how I’d feel if it were Hook, who died. I’m not saying whether they are right or wrong, but for them, Neal was why they watched the show. Love it or hate it, television production is not in business for itself. Sponsors like to advertize on shows people watch (and they must love Once a lot, because boy, are there commercials
Let’s flip the coin. If Hook died would kill the show? I don’t know. The show doesn’t revolve around him, but I can’t see his death being productive, given his high popularity (Hook draws a crowd), and don’t know how anybody else could ever equal or surpass the weight of “Captain Hook” (because great as Emma is, she can’t do it herself). As for me; myself; and I, Hook is why I watch. I probably wouldn’t watch if Hook were killed off. Not for any revenge against ABC , A&E, or the writers, but because for me, there’d just be nothing to see, so why would I watch? If Hook died, it’d take the wind out of my sails
I’d be stinking mad if it was my favorite, and would probably be one of many who’d have lots of foaming at the mouth, and vitreol over it. Let’s not judge the Neal fans. I guess this is why I understand where Neal fans are coming from. It could have just as easily been Hook.
Nobody is judging the Neal fans. But it is so depressing to read about how all the characters should die horribly and not get happy endings because Neal died and happy endings died with him etc.
No one character is the show, yeah you’d be bummed out if your favourite character died, the 311 finale was depressing because it felt like it could’ve so easily been a series finale, but that doesn’t mean just because your favourite character died that none of the characters should get a happy ending.
All magic comes with a price!
Keeper of FelixHi! I haven’t posted in quite a while. After reading all the drama with Hook and the barmaid, I thought of this scene from the movie The Wedding Date
I’ve seen people posting about how the show is no longer about hope and happy endings and basically the rest of Neal’s family should end up dying because they can’t have their happy ending with Neal gone and I just wanted to vent. It’s depressing to read how all the other characters should die horribly and not get their happy endings, just because Neal is dead. The show doesn’t revolve around Neal. Yes it was a shame Neal died and in the way he did, and it would be fair to say that nobody wanted Neal to die, because he did deserve his happy ending, but I disagree with saying that the show is no longer about hope and happy endings. To me, SwanFire were a “real” fairytale. They weren’t about slaying dragons, recuing princesses, or going on quests. They were about 2 people in the real world, finding each other despite the odds and loving each other. They’ve had to go through crap, childhood abandonment, breaking up, separated parents to Henry. Whilst Snowing and RumBelle deal with the more fantastical issues, curses, witches, etc, SwanFire always dealt with the more “real world” issues. Unfortunately, a real world issue is death of a loved one. How many children have to go through the death of their parent? How many parents have to go through the death of their child? How many people have to go through the death of their partner or death of their friend? If a family has a member in the armed forces, then that is a very real possibility for them. They may not see their loved one again. To say that, just because of the death of that person, that family is destined to never ever feel happiness again and the rest of their lives they’re screwed to misery is an absolutely horrible and depressing message to give out. Once is still about hope and happy endings, not in the idealized terms that everyone gets a happy ending, but in the real terms that despite all the tragedy and heartbreak that befalls these characters, they can still pull through, it does get better for them, they can move on without forgetting what they lost.
Agreed POM. I’m a little sick of the hatred of many on this site- it really is getting to the point where if you feel so badly about the show, dont watch it.
The show has NEVER been about Neal- if anything it has been about the Charming family & those around them by extension- the focus is usually on Emma, as we the audience go though learning about FTL etc. with her.
The show is still about hope & I sorry to any SF reading this, but A&E have been making it clear as crystal ALL S3 whom Emma is going to end up with & it wasnt Neal. Even in S2 it never once looked like Emma was actually gonna get back together with Neal- that was all FAN BASED DESIRE! I’m not saying CS WILL happen, but I am saying from S2 indicators pointed towards them happening & in S3 A&E all but hung neon signs of their backs saying “This way to a relationship” lol. If you missed it, go back & rewatch, to see how many times the camera pans between them for each of their responses, watch how Emma comes readily to rely on Hook- even when Neal shows up, it is Hook’s opinion or thoughts she seeks out.
It really does feel like people are taking head cannons far to far. Just because 1 character dies, doesnt mean every other person who knew them should either suffer a horrible fate or die as well- this just childish, petty thinking IMO.
About the second sneak peek anyone really surprised it went that way? I’m not, not in the slightest, not even a little, never thought it wouldn’t go that way even for a second. We know Hook is a man of honor, we know he loves Emma and to see the point re emphasized just because was nice…. I’ll be busy celebrating
Nope- not at all! I even thought Ariel would be the 1st to clock Hook over the head- so IMO he has every right to fight back.
I feel like, if we re-watched Tallahassee now, after seeing all this wonderful development between Captain Swan and then compare why Emma is the way she is and why her and Neal fell apart, Captain Swan make more sense now as True Loves. It goes back to that idea, that there’s a true love for you at every stage of your life. Emma now is not the same Emma she was then in Tallahassee, in the flashbacks. Emma then was hopeful for a home and love but more importantly, a home. She strongly believed in the dream for Tallahassee as their home (it seriously could have been anywhere as long as her and Neal were together). And then Neal left her and Emma ended up in jail and she became the pessimistic Emma we saw in the pilot. Emma now, is still a bit jaded but she also knows that there a lot of people who love her. And a part of still believes in that dream for Tallahassee but thinks its’ still out of reach because of who she is, the savior and product of true love. But Emma is taking baby steps towards accepting love in her life. She trusts Hook look after Henry and also trusts him to tell her the truth, even when it’s not what she wants to hear. One day soon maybe even next episode Emma is going to steadily let love back into her life because she, like her mom, value action more than words. It’s going to mean something to her once she finds out what Hook was up to in the lost year without her. It’s going to make seeing him again in The New York Serenade, more meaningful because he didn’t just come back so she could help save her family, but he came back for HER! And he’s the only man who’s done that. Hook’s actions will be incredibly meaningful to Emma once it comes out, just like how JMo expressed how meaningful it was that Hook genuinely wanted to help in 3A. The writing of this ‘ship, really when you think about, in relation to SwanFire, it’s perfect because we understand where the failures were and what Emma needs now from her true love.
This 🙂 & Now he has come back twice for her 😉
Just saw the 2nd sneak peek! I think I’m going to like this bad azz Ariel! And even though I wouldn’t have thought it horrendous and even necessarily OOC for Hook to have gone off with the wench (hehe, wench. Just that word…) but it was awesome to see that he didn’t.
Ok, and I don’t know if it was this site or another site (or both) but I cannot help but laugh when I see people’s comments on the first sneak peek. Have people never heard about body language? Have people never heard of subtext? Have people ever heard of “I’m not going to let my kid be around someone I think is a bad influence/person/someone I hate?” Seriously, it was like Emma’s pelvis was just introduced as it’s own character in that scene. Even in that tiny snippet they once again show Hook’s not afraid of Emma’s go-to defenses and she’s starting to let those walls down and actually listen when he talks to her. Oh, I love my ship!
And you know what, @Rumplegoldfan, I never really thought about it but you’re right – Hook is Emma’s best friend – and Emma his. My Dad – Mr. Cliché himself – would always say ‘forget love, you have to like the person you choose to be with first.’ And even when they’re driving each other nuts, you can tell, they really do like to be in each other’s presence. Awww, our ship! Our ship!
I am reading through posts quickly. Who said they think a big part of the problem is that SF folks didn’t prepare themselves for the fact that Neal was going to die?? I agree. Unless they were secretly preparing themselves, there was a lot of talk going around that Neal wasn’t dying and they were continuing to theorize about SF were True Love and minute SF details of how S3B was going to end. I admit that as far as I could see the writing was on the wall for Neal, both on the show as well as with BTS info, but I had also mentally prepared myself for the chance that we were all completely wrong and they could be killing off Hook instead. I reminded myself how I originally fell in love with Rumbelle and how OQ was starting to look pretty darn appealing. And most of all I reminded myself that I originally loved the show before I shipped anyone. So if Hook was killed off I knew I would be disappointed but I also knew that I would still be able to find things I enjoyed on the show. But I DID mentally prepare myself for the possibility that it could be Hook and do admit to breathing a bit of a sigh of relief when Neal died and it wasn’t Hook – not that I was wanting ANY character to die. But, seriously. For people’s sanity. Take a break. Netflix the heck out of some other show for awhile. Find some other couple on another show to ship like mad so it won’t be as painful to come back and watch. Then maybe you will find that you can enjoy the show all over again.
Agreed
You know something that just occurred to me? Killian is Emma’s best friend. Emma doesn’t have friends. She moved from place to place her entire life. From foster home to foster home as a child and teenager. Then she moved from city to city and lived on her own as an adult. Mary Margaret was the closest thing to a friend she ever had but then she broke the curse and MM tried going all Mommy Snow on her and ruined the close “friendly” relationship they had. Neal was never back long enough without “dying” for her to really establish any kind of relationship with him. In her “fake” year I have the impression that Emma and Henry were very close but that Emma was very busy with work and being a mom, and her left over time was dating Walsh – which didn’t feel like a “deep” relationship to me. The one person who she is consistently “with” – even if it’s a pattern of being flirty and then getting mad/annoyed/frustrated/scared/running away and coming back again – is Killian. And he has become the one person she listens too, looks to for advice, trusts her son with, shows her emotions too, etc. It might be because she doesn’t have many, but it doesn’t change the fact that Killian is Emma’s best friend. My mom once asked me when I was a just a bit older than Emma and divorced from my first husband who my best friend was, since I lived far away from all my high school and college friends. When I thought about it I realized that my best friend was this guy I worked with even though it had never really occurred to me before. We worked together a lot on projects so we knew each other really well, he knew my capabilities and believed that I was really good at things, we joked around and had fun together, we could tell when we were each having a bad day and needing to just let the other person have space. We just kind of naturally ended up together in meetings and at conferences, etc. but I had never really considered that he was my best friend. Then one day I did. Oh yeah, I ended up marrying my best friend.
I totally agree with this as well- I fully believe Emma needs a best friend in her partner/husband- because thats the only way she’ll look into romantic love again, when she’s with someone she fully knows- inside & out, good & bad etc. I just cant see Emma falling for someone & acting on it without 1st knowing EVERY ASPECT possible of that person 1st & perhaps that’s where some of Emma’s stand offish-ness is coming from- She’s missing a year of ‘what happened’ info with Hook, so there is now this unknown quantity to their relationship on her side, that wasnt there before, but she is friends & trusts him as such, so hasnt pushed for the info she really wants/needs to think about moving forward (& she really wants it- since we’ve seen her ask twice now 😉 ).
Oh yeah, I ended up marrying my best friend.
Can I just say awwww- that’s so sweet 🙂
I actually empathize with Neal’s fans. I know how I’d feel if it were Hook, who died. I’m not saying whether they are right or wrong, but for them, Neal was why they watched the show. Love it or hate it, television production is not in business for itself. Sponsors like to advertize on shows people watch (and they must love Once a lot, because boy, are there commercials Let’s flip the coin. If Hook died would kill the show? I don’t know. The show doesn’t revolve around him, but I can’t see his death being productive, given his high popularity (Hook draws a crowd), and don’t know how anybody else could ever equal or surpass the weight of “Captain Hook” (because great as Emma is, she can’t do it herself). As for me; myself; and I, Hook is why I watch. I probably wouldn’t watch if Hook were killed off. Not for any revenge against ABC , A&E, or the writers, but because for me, there’d just be nothing to see, so why would I watch? If Hook died, it’d take the wind out of my sails I’d be stinking mad if it was my favorite, and would probably be one of many who’d have lots of foaming at the mouth, and vitreol over it. Let’s not judge the Neal fans. I guess this is why I understand where Neal fans are coming from. It could have just as easily been Hook.
Nobody is judging the Neal fans. But it is so depressing to read about how all the characters should die horribly and not get happy endings because Neal died and happy endings died with him etc. No one character is the show, yeah you’d be bummed out if your favourite character died, the 311 finale was depressing because it felt like it could’ve so easily been a series finale, but that doesn’t mean just because your favourite character died that none of the characters should get a happy ending.
Again, Agreed POM 🙂
I wrote a post about this. I feel part of the problem with Neal’s death for SwanFire and Neal fans, is that they never fully prepared themselves for the possibility that the death would be him.
I think the problem is that many viewers still think that SF was TL and that if half of a TL couple died – there is no happy ending for the other. Since they cannot get past that, they will have a hard time enjoying the current story
Yes, I think thats a large part of the problem as well.
There will be no rationalizing with fans like that… regardless of their ship. Any one who subscribes to the misery loves company rule of life is not going to see reason. Anyone who wishes for others to die because one person did is just nuts. I know families that fly separately just in the event a tragedy happens and the whole family is not wiped out. These crazy people are pretty much saying they want Emma and Henry to go down in flames because Neal did. And as much as I didnt want Neal to die and as sympathetic as I am to a main character and a ship dying I feel like Neal has become St Neal. Really now! No matter Hook’s path to try and obtain some sort of redemption it is never enough, but Neal’s character was devolving in front of our eyes and that is all explained away due to the terrible circumstances he found himself in… And the whole ‘how would you feel if it was Hook?’ I would say that sucked – yet another couple I shipped that sunk at sea. What are you going to do? I’ve been there, done that… hey any one see Good Wife? – I’m not wishing the same for the rest of the cast.
There is no SF – A&E never planned it.
Neal is dead
Hook has issues but is not the devil in disguise.
Time to move on
its just a shame that all ships seem to have those few crazy fans that then cast a shadow on the rest.
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