The Captain Swan thread!

[ellemo78]

For Emma’s story, yes I agree, because it’s been confirmed that given who she is/her nature/being the product of TL, drives her to want TL & a HEA for herself, so yes, absolutely it would be a let down not to see that fulfilled & honestly why I dont think SF were ever “TL”, by Snowing/Rumbelle/Fairy Tale standards- but for CS, I’m not worried if TLK happens or not, the story is epic without it so far … I will dance the happy dance & fangirl to extremes if it does happen though LOL

The SF TL thing, I’m sure was all Belle’s fault, when she says the pendant was born out of true love and that’s why it apparently survived the trip back to the EF. I love that, true love = nicked from a convenience shop. Besides, when did Belle become the authority on TL? Surely that was just her opinion. How long had she actually known Neal? And did she know about the leaving Emma in jail thing? B/c the ‘stiltskin boys seem to omit a lot of information about their previous loves when they’re talking about it to Belle.

[surayya]

surayya wrote:

For Emma’s story, yes I agree, because it’s been confirmed that given who she is/her nature/being the product of TL, drives her to want TL & a HEA for herself, so yes, absolutely it would be a let down not to see that fulfilled & honestly why I dont think SF were ever “TL”, by Snowing/Rumbelle/Fairy Tale standards- but for CS, I’m not worried if TLK happens or not, the story is epic without it so far … I will dance the happy dance & fangirl to extremes if it does happen though LOL

The SF TL thing, I’m sure was all Belle’s fault, when she says the pendant was born out of true love and that’s why it apparently survived the trip back to the EF. I love that, true love = nicked from a convenience shop. Besides, when did Belle become the authority on TL? Surely that was just her opinion. How long had she actually known Neal? And did she know about the leaving Emma in jail thing? B/c the ‘stiltskin boys seem to omit a lot of information about their previous loves when they’re talking about it to Belle.

This, absolutely agree & Belle has already spouted “facts” that were wrong…. so, yeah- she’s full of “opinions”, which SF & NF fans choose to take as fact. Besides, Hook giving up the JR is “born out of TL”, yet that doesnt automatically = they are “TL” yet 😉

[ellemo78]

This, absolutely agree & Belle has already spouted “facts” that were wrong…. so, yeah- she’s full of “opinions”, which SF & NF fans choose to take as fact. Besides, Hook giving up the JR is “born out of TL”, yet that doesnt automatically = they are “TL” yet

Oh no no. Apparently Hook giving up his ship is born out of pure selfishness. A sacrifice like that couldn’t possibly be true love b/c that was Hook just doing anything he could to be with the woman he loves… oh wait. 😉

If one is to engage with the primordial forces of darkness, one must expect a little social awkwardness

[surayya]

surayya wrote:

This, absolutely agree & Belle has already spouted “facts” that were wrong…. so, yeah- she’s full of “opinions”, which SF & NF fans choose to take as fact. Besides, Hook giving up the JR is “born out of TL”, yet that doesnt automatically = they are “TL” yet

Oh no no. Apparently Hook giving up his ship is born out of pure selfishness. A sacrifice like that couldn’t possibly be true love b/c that was Hook just doing anything he could to be with the woman he loves… oh wait.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL Yep.

This pretty much sums up my reaction to some of the septic fans on this site 😉

 LOL

 

[obisgirl]

My problem with the SF necklace, we’ve already heard two contradictory statements about it.

Emma said she kept it as a reminder not to trust anyone. And look what happened when she stopped wearing it? She started to trust Hook , to open herself up to trusting him. So I’d say that Emma’s statement about what it means to her is more accurate. And as soon she started wearing the necklace,  she started not trusting Hook again.

Also, Charming said in passing in 3b premiere that Regina said that all their things were brought over with the curse. Emma gave back the necklace to Neal in Manhattan, so Neal would have the necklace regardless.

I love Belle but at least when it comes to love, she can be quite naive. Rumple is not only her true love but first love.

[surayya]

My problem with the SF necklace, we’ve already heard two contradictory statements about it. Emma said she kept it as a reminder not to trust anyone. And look what happened when she stopped wearing it? She started to trust Hook , to open herself up to trusting him. So I’d say that Emma’s statement about what it means to her is more accurate. And as soon she started wearing the necklace, she started not trusting Hook again. Also, Charming said in passing in 3b premiere that Regina said that all their things were brought over with the curse. Emma gave back the necklace to Neal in Manhattan, so Neal would have the necklace regardless. I love Belle but at least when it comes to love, she can be quite naive. Rumple is not only her true love but first love.

That’s a very good point & kind of falls with in line to what I had been thinking about- It meant one thing to Emma & another to Neal.

For Emma it was her talisman of how untrustworthy & soul destroyingly painful Neal (& by extension men in general) are able to be to her if she loves them.

For Neal it was simply a gift given out of love.

Belle has no clue what Neal’s & Emma’s relationship really was like, because she hasnt asked Emma about it (until it’s mentioned/seen on screen or A&E say otherwise, it hasnt happened imo). Since Belle wasnt really on ‘speaking terms’ with Regina at that point, she wouldnt have actually known how the curse worked- it’s not like there’s the ‘everything you need to know about what happens after you break the dark curse” book lying around, so I think shejust  projected what she’d have like to be true, as fact.

The same as Belle has no clue about what really happened with Rumple murdering Milah because Rumple wouldnt give her the why & hows & she hasnt asked Killy to explain any more after telling him he has a ‘rotten to the core heart’, but Rumple’s ‘has good/love in it’- I mean, say what now? This is where Belle’s 1st love = her TL cuts her ‘facts of life’ off at the knees (much the same as Snow’s). I’m sure Hook did some less than noble stuff while a pirate, but he lived by a code when it came to the big things- like taking a life… Rumple went around “wantongly” murdering people- just cause, you know, easier & stuff. But yeah sure, the guy avenging the murder of his lover from 300 odd years ago, is rotten to the core, while the darkone has a place or pure goodness/love at the ready 😉 I totally agree on what you say about the place that Belle is coming from

[obisgirl]

Since Belle wasn’t really on ‘speaking terms’ with Regina at that point, she wouldn’t have actually known how the curse worked- it’s not like there’s the ‘everything you need to know about what happens after you break the dark curse” book lying around, so I think she just projected what she’d have like to be true, as fact.

I agree, but it’s still inaccurate.

[surayya]

So I was chatting with some SF fans/shippers (totally by accident lol) & they mentioned something really interesting when we got to talking about OUAT & Emma ships, that in hindsight fits really well with what we’ve insisted all along- Neal’s story was mostly about family repeating the same mistakes & more specifically healing the rift with Rumple. What we got to talking about was how the guys differed by the time curse 2.0 hit….

Now I promise, this is coming directly from 3 different SF fans- all 3 agreed (this is the very short & to the point version), they made the observation, that Neal saw/knew Emma had feelings for Hook (the good byes etc.) & that obviously Hook was genuine in his feelings for Emma & he knew Hook was the one person in all of EF/FTL who would absolutely find a way- no matter how impossible it seemed, to get to Emma & gain her trust enough that she’d drink the memory potion. They made a good point, that he didnt send the potion & note to someone magical, which would have made more sense- like  Blue or even Ariel or Tink, anyone well versed in Realm travel would have done, he sent them to Hook, because he knew he’d get to Emma no matter what & that the feelings & friendship they had for each other before curse 2.0, would echo through & allow her to trust Hook. That was a really nice observation for them to make dont you think? 🙂

They also said they can see how committed to Emma, Hook is now- that he wont give up on her or leave her behind, that he loves her deeply & isnt just init to win “things” with her, & while they still feel Neal did the right thing in leaving Emma (& that they had TL etc.), they can see how detrimental it was to her in the long run & how hard Hook has had to work to prove not all men are going to leave her like that. They said they also went Nawwwww when Killy finally told her how he was able to portal jump & they said it was touching that he gave up the thing he loved most just to get her & take her home.

These SF fans, totally restored my faith in some of the people who ship SF/NF- despite their ship not sailing, they get the story being told, they understand what they wanted to happen & hoped would happen, isnt the direction the writers wanted to go in & while it sucks for their ship, it’s not the end of the world or the show- I mean 2 of them still feel SF could have been made to work- (I linked them to the meta I posted back on pg 117, which had one of them thinking about their ship in a whole new light, which lead to even more interesting discussion 😉 ), but they all said ‘in hind sight, they could see how events were being laid down for CS to end up happening over SF’ & we all agreed that it sucked that Neal & Henry didn’t, at the very least, get any closure, as Henry now has the memories of what Neal did to Emma & the pain it caused her for over a decade, that he can never address with his father & that is a pretty heavy burden for any kid to have, especially one who thought his father had never done anything “bad” or “harmful”.

Anyway, I thought since most of the SF & NF fans on this site are so darn negative about everything now, that I’d just share this very positive experience with everyone as proof that positive, reasonable SF & NF fans are out there & the fandom can still be a fun place no matter who or what you ship 🙂

 

[surayya]

surayya wrote:

Since Belle wasn’t really on ‘speaking terms’ with Regina at that point, she wouldn’t have actually known how the curse worked- it’s not like there’s the ‘everything you need to know about what happens after you break the dark curse” book lying around, so I think she just projected what she’d have like to be true, as fact.

I agree, but it’s still inaccurate.

Oh yes, I agree totally.

I was just just saying that from her point of view (even she was wrong/incorrect), she was like Neal & how he thought the necklace = love. Not that it makes sense, since it wasnt like she had the chipped cup on her when they crossed over- but it seems that’s Belle 😉

[obisgirl]

So I was chatting with some SF fans/shippers (totally by accident lol) & they mentioned something really interesting when we got to talking about OUAT & Emma ships, that in hindsight fits really well with what we’ve insisted all along- Neal’s story was mostly about family repeating the same mistakes & more specifically healing the rift with Rumple.

Oh wow, that was very insightful @surayya. I’m shocked.

I loved your first point, how it was about family making the same mistakes. This is why I need the audio commentary from the DVD’s posted already because apparently, in one of those commentaries, Colin or someone talks about how it’s a pattern on the show when it comes to family abandonment. Especially when it comes to Rumple’s family. You keep on seeing the same thing happen.

Malcolm abandoned Rumple.

Milah abandoned Rumple and Bae.

Rumple abandoned Neal.

Neal abandoned Emma.

And if Hook had abandoned Emma, it would have absolutely reinforced her belief that everyone she cares about or people who care for her, eventually abandon her.  So it’s better to push those people away instead of letting them.

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